>> FUNDING FOR NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS IS PROVIDED BY VIEWERS LIKE YOU.

>> Jeff: THIS WEEK ON NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS, DEMOCRACY IN DOLLARS, HOW MORE AND MORE MONEY IS INFLUENCING CANDIDATES AND THE VOTERS THEY'RE COURTING EACH ELECTION CYCLE.

AND -- >> Begay: IN THIS INDIGENOUS WORLDVIEW, WE KNOW THAT, YOU KNOW, LAND REALLY CAN'T BE OWNED.

WE NEED TO GET INVOLVED BECAUSE I WANT TO HAVE PEOPLE HEAR THE VOICES OF THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLE.

>> Jeff: REIMAGINING COLUMBUS FROM AN INDIGENOUS PERSPECTIVE, A NAVAJO ARCHITECT EXPLAINS HER APPROACH AS SHE LEADS A PROJECT TO REPLACE COLONIAL MONUMENTS IN OHIO'S CAPITAL CITY.

NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS STARTS NOW.

THANK YOU FOR JOINING US THIS WEEK, I'M EXECUTIVE PRODUCER JEFF PROCTOR.

WE'RE GETTING A NEW LOOK AT WHO CONTRIBUTED TO A DARK MONEY GROUP THAT BACKED MODERATE DEMOCRATS WHILE TRYING TO SHUT DOWN PROGRESSIVES DURING PRIMARY SEASON.

A STATE COURT JUDGE FORCED THE NEW MEXICO PROJECT TO REVEAL ITS FUNDING SOURCES.

THE LARGEST AMOUNT COMING FROM THE CHEVRON CORPORATION.

IN LESS THAN 20 MINUTES, SENIOR PRODUCER LOU DiVIZIO SPEAKS TO THE JOURNALIST WHO DUG INTO THE PAC'S FUNDING SOURCES AND A FORMER STATE POLITICIAN TURNED POLITICAL SCIENCE PROFESSOR TO ASK HOW THE MONEY BEHIND THAT GROUP AND OTHERS IS INFLUENCING OUR ELECTIONS.

LATER, WE EXPLORE AN UPCOMING EVENT IN ALBUQUERQUE TO EQUIP NEW PARENTS WITH THE INFORMATION AND RESOURCES THEY NEED.

NEXT SATURDAY, OCTOBER 19th, ALBUQUERQUE'S MAIN LIBRARY ON COPPER IS HOSTING A COMMUNITY BABY SHOWER.

IN ABOUT 45 MINUTES, COORDINATOR DEBORAH HASSI TELLS LOU IT'S A GREAT STARTING POINT FOR ANY NEW OR EXPECTING PARENT TRYING TO SET THEIR CHILD UP FOR SHORT AND LONG-TERM SUCCESS.

BUT WE BEGIN TONIGHT WITH A HOOK AHEAD TO MONDAY, FEDERALLY RECOGNIZED AS COLUMBUS DAY, BUT ACKNOWLEDGED BY MANY OTHERS AS INDIGENOUS PEOPLES' DAY.

PUBLIC CONSCIOUSNESS AROUND COLONIAL ATROCITIES AND CULTURAL OPPRESSION HAS GROWN DRAMATICALLY ACROSS THE COUNTRY IN RECENT YEARS, INCLUDING CHRISTOPHER COLUMBUS'S NAMESAKE CITY IN CENTRAL OHIO.

A STATUE HONORING COLUMBUS WAS REMOVED FROM CITY HALL THERE IN 2020.

NOW, A NAVAJO ARCHITECT FROM NEW MEXICO IS WORKING ON A REPLACEMENT.

ANTONIA GONZALES SITS DOWN WITH INDIGENOUS DESIGN AND PLANNING INSTITUTE FOUNDER TAMARAH BEGAY TO ASK HOW HER TEAM IS APPROACHING THE PROJECT.

>> Antonia: TAMARAH, WELCOME TO NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS.

>> Begay: THANK YOU, ANTONIA.

>> Antonia: LET ME SHARE A LIT BIT OF HISTORY.

IN 2020, THE CITY OF COLUMBUS REMOVED A 20-FOOT, MORE THAN 3-TON, BRONZE STATUE OF COLUMBUS AT CITY HALL.

AND THE CITY SAYS, AMONG THINGS, THE STATUE REPRESENTS OPPRESSION AND DIVIDES PEOPLE.

SINCE ITS REMOVAL, THIS PROJECT HAS BEEN IN THE WORKS.

HOW DID YOU GET INVOLVED?

>> Begay: I GOT INVOLVED ABOUT A YEAR AND A HALF AGO.

THERE WAS A COMPANY OUT IN COLUMBUS, OHIO, CALLED DESIGNING LOCAL.

AND THEY REACHED OUT TO ME AND THEY SAID, OH, WE'RE DOING SOME RESEARCH TO FIND AN INDIGENOUS FIRM THAT WE COULD CONNECT TO HELP WITH THIS PROJECT.

SO, THEY INTRODUCED ME TO THE PROJECT AND LIKE THE FIRST THING I THOUGHT ABOUT WAS LIKE OH, WOW, THEY'RE LOOKING FOR SOMEONE TO, LIKE, REDESIGN OR PUT SOMETHING BACK IN ITS PLACE FOR THE STATUE.

I WAS LIKE, WELL, THAT'S A BIG UNDERTAKING.

AND IT IS ALSO A VERY CONTROVERSIAL PROJECT.

SO, I TALKED WITH THEM AND I REALLY KIND OF EMPHASIZED OUR APPROACH, WHICH IS, LIKE, DIFFERENT FROM A LOT OF ARCHITECTURE FIRMS.

AND IT'S REALLY ABOUT LISTENING TO PEOPLE'S STORIES.

BECAUSE I FEEL LIKE AS AN INDIGENOUS PERSON, LIKE, HOW WE COME UP WITH OUR CONCEPTS IS REALLY ABOUT LISTENING TO PEOPLE.

AND I ALWAYS SAY, YOU REALLY HAVE TO LISTEN BECAUSE IT'S NOT JUST LIKE, OH, HOW'S YOUR DAY.

BUT IT'S REALLY ABOUT UNDERSTANDING THE UNDERLYING TRUTHS ABOUT PEOPLE'S STORIES.

SO, THEY LIKE THAT APPROACH.

AND ONCE WE GOT INTO THE PROJECT WE HAD TO WORK WITH DIFFERENT TYPES OF GROUPS.

SO, I WAS LIKE, OKAY, YEAH, THIS IS DEFINITELY DIFFERENT, IN A WAY.

BUT REALLY HOW WE WON THE PROJECT WAS BASICALLY EXPLAINING TO THEM THAT, YOU KNOW, WE'RE GOING TO LISTEN TO THE VOICES.

AND ALSO, INCORPORATING SOME OF THIS INDIGENOUS WORLDVIEW INTO OUR THOUGHT PROCESS.

SO, THEY REALLY LIKED THAT IDEA.

AND IT WAS DIFFERENT, AND ALSO DIFFERENT FOR A CITY.

>> Antonia: AND THERE ARE A LOT OF PEOPLE INVOLVED IN THIS PROJECT WORKING WITH THE COMMUNITY.

AND THE AREA WHERE THIS STATUE IS GOING TO BE, IT COULD BE A NEW STATUE, ART WORK, LANDSCAPE, OR EVEN A BUILDING.

CAN YOU EXPAND ON YOUR APPROACH AND THE INDIGENOUS VIEW?

>> Begay: YEAH, SO OUR APPROACH IS, FIRST, IS THAT WE WANT TO -- IT'S CALLED THE PARTICIPATORY PLANNING PROCESS.

SO, TYPICALLY WHEN YOU GO TO ARCHITECTURE SCHOOL THEY CALL IT -- WELL WE'RE GOING TO HAVE COMMUNITY MEETINGS.

AND USUALLY THERE'S A TIME FRAME.

THEY'RE LIKE, WELL, WE HAVE A WEEK AND A HALF TO GET PEOPLE'S COMMENTS, AND WE CAN INCORPORATE IT INTO THE DESIGN.

BUT OUR PROCESS IS, LIKE, WE GO IN AND WE'RE JUST GOING TO LISTEN.

WE DON'T HAVE ANY PRECONCEIVED NOTION OF WHAT THE PROJECT IS GOING TO BE.

I THINK, LIKE, IN ARCHITECTURE SCHOOL THE WAY WE'RE TAUGHT IS, WELL, YOU'RE THE PROFESSIONALS.

YOU TELL US WHAT WE NEED.

BUT WHAT WE DO IS WE LISTEN TO THOSE STORIES, AND WHAT COMES OUT OF IT, AND WHAT'S UNIQUE ABOUT IT IS WE COME UP WITH THE DESIGN PRINCIPLES.

SO, IT'S IMPORTANT.

FOR THE PROJECT WE HAVE ACTUALLY THREE DIFFERENT SITES.

AND ONE IS REALLY CLOSE TO THE RIVER.

ONE IS CLOSE TO A VETERANS MEMORIAL BUILDING.

AND ONE IS A PARK.

SO, WE'RE GOING TO TAKE THOSE DESIGN PRINCIPLES AND WE'RE GOING TO USE IT, AND WE'RE GOING TO COME UP, ONE WITH A BUILDING, ONE WITH A LANDSCAPE, OR ONE WITH AN ART PIECE WORK.

SO, YOU CAN TAKE THAT, AND I THINK IT'S GOING TO BE UNIQUE BECAUSE IT'S A CITY, A VERY CITY-URBAN PROJECT.

AND TO HAVE THE CITY OF COLUMBUS THINK ABOUT THESE INDIGENOUS IDEOLOGIES IS UNIQUE BECAUSE I DON'T SEE THAT IN AREAS THAT HAVE A REAL HIGH POPULATION OF INDIGENOUS PEOPLES.

SO, THE INDIGENOUS WORLDVIEW IS INCORPORATED.

IT'S ABOUT REALLY HAVING THAT CONNECTION TO, LIKE, MOTHER EARTH AND FATHER SKY.

AND REALLY APPRECIATING -- BECAUSE SUSTAINABILITY WAS REALLY NOT PART OF -- LIKE EVERYONE TALKS ABOUT SUSTAINABILITY, AND I SAID THERE'S NO WORD.

LIKE INDIGENOUS KNOWLEDGE CULTURES FOR SUSTAINABILITY BECAUSE WE'RE ABLE TO LISTEN TO THE EARTH.

WE'RE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND THE WINDS.

WE SHOULD BE ABLE TO UNDERSTAND THE SEASONS.

AND WE CORPORATE THAT IN A VERY COLLABORATIVE AND A VERY DEMOCRATIC AND A VERY MATERNALISTIC APPROACH, RATHER THAN HOW WE WOULD LOOK AT A DESIGN PROJECT, WOULD BE REALLY OPPOSITE OF THAT.

>> Antonia: AND WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT LISTENING TO ALL VOICES, THE PROJECT ALSO AIMS TO AMPLIFY VOICES THAT ARE NOT MAYBE SO HEARD, MARGINALIZED, AND TELLING HISTORY.

THAT INCLUDES THE INDIGENOUS VOICE.

SO, WHEN YOU APPROACH THIS PROJECT, WHY WAS IT IMPORTANT AS AN INDIGENOUS PERSON TO BE PART OF IT?

>> Begay: I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT, AND WHAT REALLY CAUGHT MY EYE, I WAS REALLY DRAWN TO THE PROJECT WAS THAT I REMEMBER, YOU KNOW, AT A YOUNG AGE, AND I THINK WE ALL CAN GO BACK TO GRADE SCHOOL WHEN WE LEARNED ABOUT COLUMBUS.

CHRISTOPHER COLUMBUS.

I REMEMBER ALL THE EDUCATIONAL BOOKS, THE HOLIDAYS, WERE LIKE CHRISTOPHER COLUMBUS DISCOVERED AMERICA.

AND IN, LIKE, IN THIS INDIGENOUS WORLDVIEW WE KNOW THAT LAND REALLY CAN'T BE OWNED.

LIKE, LAND IS SHARED, SO THAT WE HAVE TO PROTECT YOUR LAND IN A WAY.

SO, I'M LIKE, WELL, WE NEED TO GET INVOLVED BECAUSE I WANT TO HAVE PEOPLE HEAR THE VOICES OF THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLE.

I THINK THAT'S IMPORTANT BECAUSE DURING THIS PROCESS THE INDIGENOUS VOICES HAVE BEEN ALWAYS TAKEN OUT.

AND I THINK IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT THAT, YOU KNOW, WE CAN HEAR WHAT PEOPLE, YOU KNOW, HAVE HEARD.

I MEAN, WE OBVIOUSLY KNOW THAT, YOU KNOW, CHRISTOPHER COLUMBUS DID NOT DISCOVER AMERICA.

AND THAT, YOU KNOW, HE WAS COMING OVER.

I MEAN, HE WAS TRYING TO HAVE -- THE WAY THAT I THINK OF IT, YOU KNOW, IN THIS MORE, YOU KNOW, INDIGENOUS WORLD VIEW IS THAT HE WAS TRAVELING TO FIND A BETTER PLACE.

NOT JUST FOR HIM, NOT JUST FOR HIS FAMILY AND HIS PEOPLE, BUT IT WAS LIKE HE IMMIGRATED TO HERE.

AND WE HAVE THIS CONVERSATION NOW ABOUT IMMIGRATION, RIGHT?

AND IT'S LIKE, WELL, IF YOU THINK ABOUT THESE THINGS, LIKE, YOU KNOW PEOPLE WERE HERE, YOU KNOW, TO DISCOVER THINGS AND IMPLEMENT THINGS, IN A WAY.

AND, YOU KNOW, HOW WE CAN MAKE TRADE -- THERE'S ALL THESE THINGS THAT I'M LIKE, WELL, THE INDIGENOUS PEOPLE NEED TO HEAR THEIR VOICES BECAUSE WE WERE HERE.

AND, YOU KNOW, WE LIVED OFF THE LAND, AND YOU KNOW, WE WANTED TO MAKE THIS PLACE HOME.

AND THEN PEOPLE CAME IN AND BASICALLY, YOU KNOW, DID ALL THE BAD THINGS THAT WE HEAR AND BASICALLY CHASED US OFF, YOU KNOW, THE LAND.

NOW IT'S LIKE WE HAVE TO LIVE INTO THESE DIFFERENT RESERVATIONS.

AND IT'S LIKE, WELL, YOU KNOW, IT'S HARD TO NOT HAVE A CONVERSATION THAT IS REALLY IMPORTANT TO HISTORY, AND I THINK IF WE COULD IMPLEMENT SOME OF THESE INDIGENOUS VALUES, YOU KNOW, IN OUR DAILY THINKING AND OUR LIVES AND IN THE BUILD ENVIRONMENT, THAT MAYBE WE WOULDN'T BE HAVING THESE, YOU KNOW, CRAZY CONVERSATIONS ABOUT, OKAY, WELL, YOU KNOW, RIGHTS.

PEOPLES RIGHTS.

OR SUSTAINABILITY.

YOU KNOW, THERE'S JUST SO MANY THINGS I FEEL LIKE INCORPORATING INTO, YOU KNOW, A BUILT ENVIRONMENT.

THESE INDIGENOUS VALUES.

I THINK IT'S VALID.

WE NEED TO LEARN FROM OUR PAST.

>> Antonia: AND, OF COURSE, TALKING ABOUT HISTORY AND COLUMBUS, THERE ARE PEOPLE OUT THERE THAT DON'T WANT CHANGE.

THEY DON'T WANT STATUES REMOVED.

THEY DON'T WANT COLUMBUS DAY REPLACED.

SO, CAN YOU TALK ABOUT HOW THE PROJECT REALLY HAS WORKED ON BUILDING AN UNDERSTANDING AND CONNECTION WITH THE COMMUNITY?

>> Begay: A LOT OF THE COMMUNITIES THAT WE HAVE WORKED WITH, ONE, YOU'VE GOT THE ITALIAN COMMUNITY.

THEY ARE VERY PROUD OF THEIR HISTORY.

AND, YOU KNOW, THEY DON'T WANT THE STATUE REMOVED.

BUT I THINK THE UNDERLYING STORY AND THE COMMONALITY BETWEEN THEM AND ALSO AFRICAN AMERICANS TOO, HISPANICS, THE ASIANS, WITHIN THE COLUMBUS AREA IS THAT WE HAVE TO THINK OF IT, YOU KNOW, AT A HIGHER LEVEL OF, YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT JUST A STATUE BECAUSE IF THAT STATUE WAS NOT THERE, IT'S OUR VOICES THAT ARE GOING TO CARRY THAT HISTORY.

AND I ALWAYS TIE THAT TO THIS INDIGENOUS WORLDVIEW.

IT'S LIKE, WELL, A LOT OF OUR HISTORY AND CULTURE IS PASSED DOWN THROUGH VOICES BY GENERATION AND GENERATION.

IF THAT STATUE WAS THERE AND IT WASN'T THERE, WE STILL HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO BE ABLE TO EDUCATE PEOPLE ABOUT IT, RIGHT?

AND WE CAN BE PROUD NO MATTER WHAT.

I MEAN, THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS THAT MAYBE PEOPLE DON'T REALLY -- ARE EDUCATED ABOUT.

ESPECIALLY LIKE THE CODE TALKERS.

THERE'S A LOT OF INDIGENOUS CULTURES THAT HELP WITH THE CODE.

AND THEY WERE INSTRUMENTAL ABOUT THIS HISTORY AND HOW WORLD WAR II WAS WON.

SO, I THINK -- LIKE WHEN I WENT IN AND HAD MEETING WITH THE ITALIAN COMMUNITIES.

THEY WERE UP IN HAND AND THEY WERE VERY UPSET BECAUSE THEY DIDN'T WANT TO SEE THE STATUE BE TAKEN DOWN.

I WENT INTO THE COMMUNITY AND DID A PRESENTATION, AND I EXPLAINED TO THEM THIS INDIGENOUS WORLDVIEW PROCESS THAT EVERYTHING'S CONNECTED AND IT'S ALL ABOUT, YOU KNOW, RESPECT.

IT'S ABOUT RESPECT, YOU KNOW, NOT JUST FOR OURSELVES, BUT FOR THE LAND AND THE PEOPLE.

AND AT THE END OF THAT COMMUNITY MEETING SOME OF THE ITALIANS THAT WERE VERY UPSET, THEY CAME UP AND THEY BASICALLY LIKE JUST CONGRATULATED AND GAVE ME A HUG.

AND THE TEAM MEMBERS WERE LIKE AT AWE, LIKE, HOW DID THAT HAPPEN?

AND I SAID, WELL, IT'S JUST YOU KNOW, I THINK, HAVING THIS CONVERSATION ABOUT BEING RESPECTFUL, YOU KNOW?

AND, YOU KNOW, THAT RESPECT GOES A LONG WAY.

AND IF YOU CAN SEE IT FROM DIFFERENT SIDES BECAUSE THE INDIGENOUS WAY, YOU KNOW, THINGS HAVE BEEN TAKEN AWAY.

YEAH, WE UNDERSTAND THINGS HAVE BEEN TAKEN AWAY FROM THE ITALIAN COMMUNITY, BUT IN COMMON, IT'S LIKE RESPECT.

AND HOW DO WE TAKE THAT RESPECT INTO A DESIGN THAT IS GOING TO BE A DESIGN FOR EVERYONE, FOR EVERY CULTURE.

SO THAT IS GOING TO BE -- THAT'S GOING TO BE THE CHALLENGE.

AND YOU SEE THAT IN THE AFRICAN AMERICANS.

THEY DON'T WANT THEIR HISTORY TO BE ERASED EITHER.

AND, YOU KNOW, WITH INDIGENOUS PEOPLE, WE TALK ABOUT COLONIZATION, RIGHT?

AND THEY SEE THAT AND THEY DON'T WANT THAT FOR THEIR OWN CULTURE AND THEIR OWN PEOPLE.

AND IT'S LIKE, WELL, YEAH, I UNDERSTAND.

I GET IT.

SO LET'S COME TOGETHER AND FIGURE OUT SOMETHING SO THAT WE CAN TEACH PEOPLE ABOUT THE HISTORY AND REALLY THE UNDERLYING STORY.

>> Antonia: WELL, WHERE IS THE PROJECT RIGHT NOW?

AND WHAT'S THE FUTURE OF IT?

>> Begay: SO THE PROJECT RIGHT NOW, WE'VE DONE A YEAR-LONG OF COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENTS.

AND, SO, WE JUST FINISHED UPCOMING UP WITH A DESIGN PRINCIPLE.

WE PRESENTED THE DESIGN PRINCIPLE, AND THEN WE JUST FINISHED UP SOME SITE ANALYSIS.

SO, IN THE NEXT WEEK OR TWO WE'LL ACTUALLY GET INTO THE DESIGN PIECE.

AND THE DESIGN PIECE, AND I REALLY THINK THAT THIS THREE AREAS THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT, YOU KNOW, HAVING THAT CONVERSATION AND PUTTING THOSE DESIGN PRINCIPLES, YOU WOULD SAY, LIKE, IN THIS KIND OF WESTERN WORLD, IT COULD BE A MUSEUM, BUT I DON'T WANT TO CALL IT A MUSEUM JUST YET.

BECAUSE I WANT TO NAME IT LIKE A PLACE FOR PROMISE.

OR, YOU KNOW, A PLACE FOR BEGINNING, SO THAT PEOPLE CAN UNDERSTAND AND MAKE THAT CONNECTION TO THE EARTH, MAKE THAT CONNECTION TO THE ENVIRONMENT, AND THAT MEANS LIKE THE TWO-LEGGED, THE FOUR-LEGGED BEINGS, THE WATER.

MAKE THAT CONNECTION BECAUSE, AGAIN, THAT LAND ACKNOWLEDGMENT PIECE.

AND I THINK IT'S GOING TO BE A VERY UNIQUE PROJECT.

>> Antonia: WELL, THANK YOU FOR SHARING THAT.

AND I WANTED TO ASK YOU ABOUT YOUR PROFESSION, AND WE TALKED ABOUT YOU BEING AN INDIGENOUS WOMAN, BEING AN INDIGENOUS WOMAN ON THIS PROJECT, BUT YOU FOUNDED A COMPANY HERE IN ALBUQUERQUE.

AND YOU'RE ONE OF FEW NATIVE WOMEN IN YOUR PROFESSION.

CAN YOU SHARE THE IMPORTANCE OF IT?

>> Begay: YEAH, WHEN I WENT INTO MY PROFESSION I WASN'T REALLY EDUCATED ABOUT, YOU KNOW, WOMEN THAT WERE ARCHITECTS.

AND NOT UNTIL WHEN I GOT LICENSED AS AN ARCHITECT I REALIZED THAT OH, WOW, I'M THE FIRST NAVAJO WOMAN REGISTERED ARCHITECT.

AND I WAS LIKE THAT'S REALLY AN IMPORTANT ROLE.

AND I THINK, LIKE, IT'S IMPORTANT BECAUSE WE DO NEED MORE INDIGENOUS WOMEN, YOU KNOW, THAT CAN DESIGN.

AND I FEEL LIKE WE BRING A UNIQUENESS TO THE INDUSTRY IN TERMS OF, LIKE YOUR MATERNALISTIC THINKING, AND REALLY TYING THINGS BACK TO THE PEOPLE, THE COMMUNITY, AND THAT'S REALLY NEEDED BECAUSE I FEEL LIKE AN INDIGENOUS ARCHITECTURE IS WHAT YOU SEE WHEN YOU SEE, YOU KNOW, DIFFERENT INDIGENOUS ARCHITECTURE TYPES.

THERE'S A LOT OF MEANING BEHIND IT.

AND, YOU KNOW, WE -- I FEEL LIKE OUR VOICES ARE REALLY IMPORTANT IN THAT CONVERSATION.

SO, I'M HOPING TO SEE MORE INDIGENOUS WOMEN.

THERE'S LIKE EIGHT REGISTERED INDIGENOUS WOMEN ARCHITECTS IN THE COUNTRY.

I HOPE THAT PEOPLE CAN SEE, YOU KNOW, US INDIGENOUS WOMEN AND OPEN THE DOOR FOR OTHERS TO COME.

BECAUSE IT'S LIKE THERE'S SO MUCH OPPORTUNITY AND THERE'S SO MUCH WORK OUT THERE THAT WE NEED THAT.

AND I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO HAVE -- EVEN IF PEOPLE CAN SEE YOU, AND THEY'RE SITTING OUT THERE AND THEY'RE WATCHING, AND THEY'RE LIKE, OH, I WANT TO BE AN ARCHITECT.

SO I THINK IT'S IMPORTANT, AND LIKE, AT MY FIRM, WHICH IS INDIGENOUS DESIGN STUDIO PLUS ARCHITECTURE, I REALLY ALSO TRY TO FOCUS ON BRINGING UP INDIGENOUS PEOPLE TO BE ABLE TO TAKE PART OF PROJECTS.

I THINK THAT'S REALLY IMPORTANT.

I STILL THINK THAT WE ARE BEING DISCRIMINATED AGAINST JUST BECAUSE OF OUR COLOR THAT BECAUSE WE'RE ARCHITECTS, BECAUSE YOU'RE A BUSINESS OWNER, THAT YOU'RE NOT GOOD ENOUGH TO GET THIS JOB, RIGHT?

OR YOU'RE NOT TOO BIG, BUT I'M LIKE I WANT TO GIVE THAT OPPORTUNITY.

AND I WANT PEOPLE TO ALSO EMBRACE THIS INDIGENOUS WORLDVIEW AS PART OF THEIR PLANNING PROCESS.

AND I THINK FINALLY IT'S THERE BECAUSE I FEEL LIKE URBAN CITIES, YOU KNOW, NON-INDIGENOUS PEOPLE CAN RELATE TO IT IN A WAY THAT WILL ENHANCE THEIR PROJECTS AND ENHANCE THEIR COMMUNITIES.

>> Antonia: TAMARAH, THANK YOU FOR BEING WITH US TODAY ON NEW MEXICO PBS.

>> Begay: THANK YOU.

>> Hassi: ANYONE WHO IS A FIRST-TIME PARENT, PARENTS OF PARENTS WHO ARE SUPPORTING THE EXPECTING PARENTS, PEOPLE WHO HAVE HAD TWO OR THREE BABIES, MAYBE WANT TO TRY SOMETHING A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT THIS TIME AROUND.

MAYBE THEIR FIRST BABY WAS IN A HOSPITAL SETTING.

MAYBE THEY WANT TO TRY A DOULA OR MIDWIFE THIS TIME AROUND.

SO, IT'S FOR ANYONE WHO DOESN'T KNOW WHAT THEY DON'T KNOW ABOUT THE PROCESS OF EXPECTING, DELIVERING, AND POSTPARTUM WITH HAVING A NEW LITTLE ONE IN THEIR LIVES.

>> Jeff: LOU'S INTERVIEW WITH DEBORAH HASSI FROM ALBUQUERQUE'S MAIN LIBRARY BRANCH IS COMING UP AT THE BOTTOM OF THE HOUR.

EARLY VOTING HAS BEGUN AROUND NEW MEXICO, AND WE ARE ALREADY DROWNING IN POLITICAL ADS.

BUT WHO IS BEHIND ALL THOSE COMMERCIALS AND GLOSSY MAILERS?

AND HOW MUCH INFLUENCE DO THEY REALLY HAVE ON VOTERS AS THEY CAST THEIR BALLOTS?

THAT'S ONE OF MANY QUESTIONS WE'RE GOING TO TACKLE IN OUR NEXT TWO SEGMENTS FOCUSED ON CAMPAIGN FINANCE NATIONALLY AND IN OUR STATE.

JOINING LOU AT THE TABLE THIS WEEK ARE UNM POLITICAL SCIENCE PROFESSOR, AND FORMER DEMOCRATIC STATE SENATOR, ERIC GREIGO.

AND TRIP JENNINGS, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF NEW MEXICO IN DEPTH.

HERE'S LOU.

>> Lou: ERIC GREIGO, TRIP JENNINGS, THANKS SO MUCH FOR JOINING ME ON NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS.

>> Jennings: THANK YOU.

>> Griego: GLAD TO BE HERE.

>> Lou: AS EARLY VOTING BEGINS, AND WE LOOK AHEAD TO ELECTION DAY IN NOVEMBER, WE'RE HERE TO TALK ABOUT THE INFLUENCE OF MONEY IN OUR ELECTORAL SYSTEM.

WE CAN GET INTO SPECIFICS A LITTLE LATER ON, BUT ERIC, I WANT TO START WITH YOU.

HOW MUCH MONEY IS BEING POURED INTO MAJOR CAMPAIGNS FOR THE U.S. HOUSE AND SENATE AROUND THE COUNTRY?

LET'S START THERE, COMPARED TO JUST THE LAST FEW ELECTION CYCLES?

>> Griego: YEAH, I JUST LOOKED AT OPENSECRETS WHICH TRACKS THIS IN REALTIME.

AND THIS IS GOING TO BE THE MOST EXPENSIVE RACE IN AMERICAN HISTORY.

IT'S LOOKING PRETTY CLOSE TO $16 BILLION, WHICH IS ABOUT A BILLION MORE THAN LAST TIME.

16-"B"-BILLION DOLLARS.

AND WHEN YOU ADD THE PAC MONEY TO THAT, THERE'S ANOTHER $2 OR $3 BILLION THERE.

IT LOOKS LIKE THE DEMOCRATS ARE DOING SLIGHTLY BETTER, BUT IT ALL DEPENDS ON WHERE YOU'RE COUNTING, RIGHT?

SO PEOPLE ARE PUTTING THEIR MONEY IN DIFFERENT PLACES.

THERE'S OBVIOUSLY THE CAMPAIGN, THERE'S PACs, THERE'S DARK MONEY IN SUPER PACs.

WE'LL TALK ABOUT THAT, BUT THIS IS WILL BE ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE, IF YOU LOOK AT PRE CITIZENS UNITED, THIS WILL BE, SORT OF, THREE OR FOUR TIMES WHAT WAS SPENT BEFORE THE LAW CHANGED AND TOOK THE GUARDRAILS OFF.

>> Lou: OKAY.

THANKS FOR TEEING ME UP.

CITIZENS UNITED, I WANT TO TALK ABOUT THAT 2010 RULING.

HOW HAS IT CHANGED THE WAY BIG-MONEY INTERESTS CAN FUND AND INFLUENCE CAMPAIGNS?

>> Griego: WELL, IT WAS SEMINAL.

IT ABSOLUTELY TRANSFORMED HOW CAMPAIGNS ARE FUNDED.

SO, BEFORE THE 2010 SUPREME COURT CITIZENS UNITED VERSUS THE FEC DECIDED THAT MONEY IS SPEECH.

AND THAT WE HAD -- YOU COULDN'T REGULATE HOW MUCH INDIVIDUALS, CORPORATIONS, COULD GIVE TO CAMPAIGNS.

NOW, DIRECTLY YOU COULD, BUT THERE'S THESE SUPER PACs AND THIS MONEY WE'LL BE TALKING ABOUT.

AND IT WAS UNLIMITED AMOUNTS.

SO, WHAT IT MEANT WAS THAT ANY LIMITS ON HOW, SORT OF, CLANDESTINE CAMPAIGN SPENDING, WHICH IS REALLY HARD TO TRACK, THEY'RE GONE.

BY THE WAY, IT HAPPENS ACROSS THE POLITICAL SPECTRUM.

EVERYBODY IS PLAYING THE GAME NOW BECAUSE YOU WOULD ARGUE, REGARDLESS OF YOUR POLITICS, THAT IF YOU DON'T PLAY THE GAME YOU'RE SORT OF OUT.

YOU'RE GOING TO LOSE.

SO, WHAT IS MEANT FOR ELECTIONS -- YOU CAN TRACK ALL AFTER 2010.

YOU CAN TRACK NOT JUST THE QUANTITY, BUT THREE OTHER TRENDS I'LL TALK ABOUT QUICKLY.

ONE IS HOW MUCH RACES HAVE BEEN NATIONALIZED.

MEANING, MOST MONEY COMES FOR FEDERAL RACES, CERTAINLY, BUT EVEN FOR OTHER RACES, COMES FROM OUT OF THE JURISDICTION.

BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE BETTING AND THEY WANT TO HAVE A MAJORITY WHEREVER THEY'RE TRYING IN THE PRESIDENCY.

IT'S REALLY PUSHED OUT SMALL DONORS IN A LOT OF WAYS.

SOME BIG-MONEY DONORS, THE MOST WEALTHY FOLKS ARE GIVING TO THESE SUPER PACs.

AND THEN IT'S REALLY KIND OF SHIFTED THE MONEY AROUND FROM INDIVIDUAL CAMPAIGNS TO LARGE ENTITIES LIKE SUPER PACS.

THOSE ARE THREE BIG, I THINK SINCE 2010, CITIZENS UNITED REALLY CHANGED THE WAY, NOT JUST THE QUANTITY OF MONEY WHICH HAS GROWN EXPONENTIALLY, BUT IT ALSO CHANGED THE WAY CAMPAIGN FINANCE WORKS FUNDAMENTALLY FOR OUR DEMOCRACY.

AND IT'S -- I THINK IT'S INSIDIOUS.

IT'S REALLY CHANGED -- IT'S CHANGED DEMOCRACY IN THE UNITED STATES.

>> Lou: OKAY.

TRIP, WE'LL GET INTO SOME OF YOUR RECENT REPORTING IN JUST A MINUTE, HERE.

BUT, FOR NOW, IS THAT TREND THAT ERIC'S DESCRIBING -- IS THAT HAPPENING HERE IN THE STATE AND LOCAL LEVEL TOO?

>> Jennings: OH, YEAH.

WE CAN KNOW ABOUT THE NATIONAL PICTURE, BUT YOU HAVE MAJOR PLAYERS HERE IN NEW MEXICO AS WELL AS, YOU KNOW, OUT-OF-STATE PLAYERS COMING IN.

RIGHT NOW, WE HAVE A CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICT IN THE SOUTH, SECOND, WHICH IS ACTUALLY -- PEOPLE ARE LOOKING AT AS ONE OF THE SWING DISTRICTS, BASICALLY.

GABE VASQUEZ BEAT YVETTE HERRELL TWO YEARS AGO, AND NOW THERE'S A LOT OF MONEY.

COOK POLITICAL REPORT IS CONSTANTLY TALKING ABOUT IT AS A TOSS-UP.

BUT AT THE LEGISLATIVE LEVEL, AT THE GUBERNATORIAL LEVEL, YEAH, THERE'S TONS OF MONEY.

WE HAVE MAJOR PLAYERS.

WE DID A LITTLE ANALYSIS AT NEW MEXICO IN DEPTH, AND, YOU KNOW, THE LARGEST CORPORATE GIVER THIS CYCLE, JANUARY 1, 2023 TO THIS POINT WAS CHEVRON.

BIG PLAYER.

$1.2 MILLION, AND IT'S NOT OVER.

THE CYCLE IS NOT OVER YET, SO WHO KNOWS WHERE THEY WILL REACH.

THEY GAVE $2.8 MILLION IN 2018.

SO, YOU KNOW, AND ON THE PROGRESSIVE SIDE YOU ALSO HAVE THAT KIND OF BIG MONEY NOW.

THIS IS -- WHEN WE WERE TALKING ABOUT, YOU KNOW, THERE'S THE DIRECT GIVING TO CANDIDATES, THERE'S PAC GIVING, SOMETIMES PAC TO PAC GIVING.

IT'S HARD TO TRACK THE SOURCES, WHICH WE CALL GRAY MONEY.

THERE'S A LOT OF REGIFTING OF MONEY.

AND THERE'S ALL THAT DARK MONEY THAT'S HARD TO TRACK TOO.

SO, IT'S REALLY TRICKY IN TRACKING HOW MUCH MONEY REALLY IS GOING AROUND.

AND I WANT TO SAY THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT DARK MONEY THAT BACK IN THE DAY, AT THE FEDERAL LEVEL, WHEN MCCAIN-FEINGOLD WAS PASSED THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT 527S.

THERE'S ALWAYS BEEN VEHICLES TO HIDE MONEY.

IS THAT -- >> Griego: YEAH, YOU'RE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT.

IT'S ALWAYS BEEN THIS CAT- -AND-MOUSE GAME TO TRY AND FIGURE OUT -- YOU KNOW, THIS IS A BIG -- I KNOW WE WANT TO TALK ABOUT TRANSPARENCY.

I THINK PEOPLE WANT TO KNOW WHERE THE MONEY IS COMING FROM.

THAT'S A REALLY IMPORTANT ISSUE.

AND I THINK THE BIGGER PROBLEM IS REGARDLESS, YOU KNOW, PEW AND OTHERS HAVE DONE POLLING ON THIS.

IT DOESN'T MATTER WHERE IT'S COMING FROM, LEFT, RIGHT, MIDDLE, IT'S JUST TOO MUCH.

IT'S HAVING TOO MUCH OF AN IMPACT.

AND IT'S ALSO BIDDING UP THE COST TO CAMPAIGN.

SO IF YOU'RE -- THIS IDEA THAT ANY KID CAN GROW UP TO BE PRESIDENT OR ANY KID CAN RUN FOR CONGRESS, THAT'S BECOMING HARDER AND HARDER TO BE A REALITY IN AMERICAN POLITICS BECAUSE THE FIRST LITMUS TEST IS CAN YOU RAISE MONEY.

AND ARE YOU WILLING TO RAISE MONEY.

AND IF YOU'RE NOT, YOU MIGHT WANT TO FIND ANOTHER PROFESSION.

>> Lou: I WANT TO TALK ABOUT THAT TOO.

HOW MUCH WORK MUST A CANDIDATE AND THEIR STAFF DO TO COLLECT MAJOR DONATIONS JUST TO STAY COMPETITIVE?

WHAT DOES THAT LOOK LIKE?

>> Griego: YOU KNOW, THE FIRST LITMUS TEST, AND THIS IS AT THE FEDERAL LEVEL, I THINK IT'S LESS TRUE AT THE STATE AND LOCAL LEVEL, BUT FOR CONGRESS ESPECIALLY WHEN IT'S AS NARROW IT IS, THE MAJORITY IN BOTH THE HOUSE AND SENATE, THE FIRST TEST -- YOU MIGHT BE A FANTASTIC CANDIDATE, ARE YOU TIED TO THE DISTRICT, DO YOU HAVE ANY MAJOR BAGGAGE, BUT THE REAL FIRST QUESTION IS CAN YOU AND ARE YOU WILLING TO RAISE MONEY.

AND TO EVEN MAKE IT ONTO THE RADAR SCREEN FOR THE GROUPS -- SOME OF THESE GROUPS ARE GOING TO HELP YOU.

THE NATIONAL PARTIES ON EITHER SIDE, SOME OF THE MAJOR GROUPS WHO GIVE MONEY, THE BIG DONORS, IS HE OR SHE MAKING PHONE CALLS?

ARE THEY RAISING MONEY?

AND THAT FIRST REPORT IS REALLY KIND OF LIFE AND DEATH FOR FOLKS.

IF YOU COME IN WITH A REALLY WEAK REPORT, MEANING YOU HAVEN'T DONE THE WORK OR CALLS TO RAISE THE MONEY, YOU KIND OF GET YOUR SEAT AND YOUR RACE GETS DEPRIORITIZED.

AND THIS MONEY THAT COMES INTO PARTIES AND COMES INTO PACs GETS MOVE AROUND.

SO, JOE IS NOT DOING WELL IN DISTRICT 17, OR WHATEVER, LET'S LOOK AT THIS OTHER POSSIBLE PICKUP.

AND AGAIN, THIS HAPPENS IN BOTH PARTIES.

THIS HAPPENS ACROSS THE POLITICAL SPECTRUM.

SO, SADLY, IT ALL COMES DOWN TO FUNDRAISING.

IT DOES.

WE CAN ARGUE THAT IT'S HOW GREAT A CANDIDATE YOU ARE, HOW WINNABLE THE DISTRICT IS, AND THOSE ARE ALL IMPORTANT, BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY WHAT SEPARATES THE WHEAT FROM THE CHAFF IS THE FUNDRAISING.

>> Jennings: CAN I ADD THAT THE LEGISLATURES, LEGISLATIVE RACES AND STUFF LIKE THIS OFTEN VIEWED BY THE PARTIES IS LIKE THESE ARE THE -- WE'RE GOING TO BE LOOKING FOR PEOPLE WHO CAN DO THIS WHO MIGHT BE CANDIDATES FOR A CONGRESSIONAL SEAT LATER IN THE DECADE.

RIGHT?

THEY'RE LIKE FARM TEAMS.

THEY'RE BASICALLY LOOKING AT FOLKS WHO CAN DO THAT.

SO, IT'S NOT ONLY IN THE LEGISLATIVE RACES, BUT REALLY AMBITIOUS PEOPLE HAVE TO THINK ABOUT FUNDRAISING BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO SEND THE SIGNAL THAT THEY CAN IN A DECADE, SIX YEARS, WHATEVER, THEY CAN COMPETE AT A CONGRESSIONAL LEVEL.

>> Lou: OKAY.

I JUST WANT TO SHARPEN THAT POINT, REAL QUICK.

SO, FUNDRAISING AND AMBITION IS AT THE TOP OF THE PRIORITY LIST FOR SUCCESS FOR POLITICIANS?

>> Griego: I WOULD SAY AMBITIOUS FUNDRAISING.

SO, IF YOU DON'T HAVE A HUGE NETWORK, IF YOU'RE A SCHOOL TEACHER OR WHATEVER, I THINK THAT'S LESS IMPORTANT THAN ARE YOU WILLING TO DO THE WORK.

AND, YOU KNOW, THERE HAVE BEEN LOTS OF FOLKS, OPENSECRETS, PEW, OTHER FOLKS HAVE LOOKED AT HOW MUCH TIME DOES AN AVERAGE MEMBER OF CONGRESS, FOR EXAMPLE -- AND THIS ISN'T TOTALLY DIFFERENT FOR STATE AND LOCAL OFFICES, HOW MUCH TIME DO THEY PHYSICALLY SPEND RAISING MONEY.

IT'S PHONE CALLS, IT'S SHOWING UP AT FUNDRAISERS -- AND DEPENDING ON THE RACE, DEPENDING ON THE CANDIDATE, IT'S 25%.

FOR SOME FOLKS IT'S A THIRD OF THEIR TIME.

THINK ABOUT THAT.

16 HOURS A DAY IS YOUR WORKDAY, YOU'RE SPENDING FOUR OR FIVE HOURS A DAY JUST RAISING MONEY.

>> Lou: OKAY.

WE'RE GETTING TIGHT ON TIME, AS I KNEW WE WOULD.

IT'S A PREREQUISITE THAT YOU HAVE TO RAISE ALL THIS MONEY.

ONCE YOU RAISE THAT MONEY -- SAY YOU WIN, ONCE YOU'RE IN OFFICE AS AN ELECTED OFFICIAL, WE ALWAYS HEAR THAT DONATIONS DON'T INFLUENCE THE WAY POLITICIANS GOVERN.

IS THAT TRUE IN YOUR EXPERIENCE AS A FORMER STATE SENATOR?

>> Griego: YOU KNOW, I THINK IT DEPENDS ON THE OFFICIAL, BUT I MEAN, I THINK WE -- I GUESS THE CORRECT WAY TO ANSWER THAT IS PEOPLE WHO ARE ALIGNED WITH YOU ARE GOING TO TEND TO CONTRIBUTE TO YOU.

SO WHETHER THAT'S IF YOU'RE PRO-CHOICE, IF YOU'RE PRO-CONSERVATION, THOSE FOLKS ARE NOT GOING TO GIVE TO THE OTHER SIDE.

YOU COULD SAY YOU'RE ALREADY IDEOLOGICALLY ALIGNED, OR THEY WOULDN'T BE INVESTING IN YOU AS SOMEONE WHO IS GOING TO HELP THEM ADVANCE THEIR AGENDA.

BUT I THINK IT'S JUST NAIVE TO SAY THAT IF GROUPS -- I'LL SPEAK FOR MYSELF, GROUPS THAT REALLY WENT TO BAT FOR YOU TO MAKE YOU A VIABLE CANDIDATE, WHEN THEY ASK YOU LIKE, HEY, THIS IS A REALLY IMPORTANT ISSUE TO US, YOU'RE NOT GOING TO HEAR THEM OUT, RIGHT?

YOU'RE NOT GOING TO HEAR THEM OUT.

AND THE CONVERSE IS ALSO TRUE, I DIDN'T REALLY -- IF THEY'RE FOLKS THAT ACTIVELY WORKED AGAINST THE CAMPAIGN, OR HAD A DIFFERENT VIEW IDEOLOGICALLY, I WAS LESS LIKELY TO -- I'D LISTEN TO THEM, BUT I WAS LESS LIKELY TO SORT OF SUPPORT THEIR ISSUES, RIGHT?

I'M JUST BEING HONEST.

THAT'S JUST THE WAY, SADLY, AMERICAN POLITICS ARE WORKING.

>> Jennings: IT OPENS THE DOOR.

SOMEBODY, I NEED TO PICK UP THE PHONE.

IT'S THAT KIND OF THING.

IT DOESN'T NECESSARILY LEAD TO THE NASTY STUFF, ALWAYS, THAT WE MIGHT TALK ABOUT.

A HARVARD PROFESSOR, LAWRENCE LESSIG, USED TO TALK ABOUT LEGALIZED BRIBERY, WHICH IS ACROSS CONGRESS AND STATE LEGISLATURES.

HE DIDN'T MEAN PEOPLE WERE BREAKING THE LAW, BUT IT'S THIS THING THERE'S SO MUCH MONEY THAT IF YOU'RE -- IF YOU HAVE SO MUCH MONEY, YOU CAN GIVE AND THEN SOMEONE WILL PICK UP THE PHONE AND THEY MAY NOT VOTE A CERTAIN WAY.

BUT IT ALLOWS ACCESS.

I WILL SAY, AS SOMEONE WHO COVERED A LOT OF POLITICAL CORRUPTION, FINDING THE REALLY NASTY STUFF, THAT'S HARD.

THAT'S REALLY HARD.

IT'S THERE, BUT IT'S HARD.

>> Lou: WE'VE GOT ABOUT ONE MINUTE LEFT.

WE TALKED ABOUT HOW MONEY CAN INFLUENCE CANDIDATES, BUT HOW DOES IT INFLUENCE VOTERS?

MUCH OF THE CASH THAT IS THROWN AROUND ENDS UP BEING SPENT ON ADVERTISING.

DOES THAT CHANGE HOW VOTERS VIEW CERTAIN RACES?

IS IT ALL ABOUT EXPOSURE?

HOW DOES THAT WORK EXACTLY?

>> Griego: YEAH, I MEAN MOST MONEY IN CAMPAIGNS GOES TO MEDIA, RIGHT?

I MEAN, IT USED TO BE TV COMMERCIALS AND LOCAL RACES THAT'S NOT AS EFFECTIVE.

MAYBE MAYORS RACES, BUT CONGRESSIONAL RACES SENATE RACES, OBVIOUSLY PRESIDENTIAL RACES.

BUT NOW IT'S SOCIAL MEDIA.

YOU HAVE TO SPEND A GOOD PART OF YOUR BUDGET JUST REACHING VOTERS.

YOU CAN DO IT IN A MUCH MORE TARGETED WAY WITH SOCIAL MEDIA NOW.

THAT'S WHERE MOST MONEY GOES.

BUT YOU ALSO -- THE MORE MONEY YOU RAISE, THE MORE CAPACITY YOU HAVE IN TERMS OF STAFF, THE MORE CAPACITY YOU HAVE IN TERMS OF HAVING A GOOD FIELD PROGRAM, REACHING VOTERS DOOR TO DOOR AND ON PHONES.

BUT REALLY, MOST OF THE MONEY AND MOST MAJOR RACES GOES TO MEDIA.

AGAIN, TV IS STILL BIG.

IT'S MUCH MORE TARGETED NOW, BUT SOCIAL MEDIA OPENED UP A WHOLE NEW AREA OF TARGETED ADVERTISING FOR CANDIDATES.

AND THE MORE MONEY YOU HAVE, THE MORE VOTERS YOU CAN REACH.

AND, YOU KNOW, IT'S PRETTY CLEAR, RESEARCH IS PRETTY CLEAR, HE OR SHE WHO SPENDS MOST, 85% OF THE TIME IN CONGRESSIONAL RACES, AND SOMETHING LIKE 80% IN SENATE RACES, WINS.

WHOEVER SPENDS MOST MONEY WINS.

THERE'S A DIRECT CORRELATION, ABSOLUTELY.

>> Lou: WE HAVE TO LEAVE IT THERE.

SORRY ABOUT THAT.

I KNOW LOTS TO TALK ABOUT, BUT THANK YOU.

WE NEED TO TAKE A BREAK BEFORE WE MEET BACK HERE.

WE'LL BE HERE IN AN ABOUT A MINUTE TO TALK ABOUT A RECENT STORY YOU WROTE, TRIP, ABOUT THE DONORS BEHIND A DARK MONEY GROUP THAT TRIED TO SQUASH OR PUSH FROM PROGRESSIVES THIS PAST PRIMARY.

BUT FIRST A MESSAGE FROM OUR LAND'S LAURA PASKUS.

>> Laura: HI, I'M LAURA PASKUS, SENIOR PRODUCER OF OUR LAND.

A FEW YEARS AGO I STARTED WORKING WITH MOLLI PARSONS, AN ENVIRONMENTAL EDUCATOR, TO CREATE MIDDLE SCHOOL LESSON PLANS AROUND OUR ENVIRONMENTAL PROGRAMMING.

I THOUGHT IT WOULD BE REALLY NEAT TO TAKE SOME OF OUR SHOWS ABOUT THINGS LIKE CLIMATE CHANGE, WATER, AND WILDLIFE, AND PROVIDE STUDENTS WITH LOCALIZED, ACCURATE INFORMATION ABOUT NEW MEXICO'S ENVIRONMENTAL ISSUES.

AND IT HAS BEEN SO FUN WORKING WITH MOLLI.

THIS SUMMER, WE RELEASED THREE NEW LESSON PLANS BASED ON OUR RECENT SHOW, LOVING OUR CHANGING HOMELANDS.

THE THREE NEW LESSONS FEATURE VIDEOS FROM PAULA GARCIA, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE NEW MEXICO ACEQUIA ASSOCIATION, AND TERESA PASQUAL AND AARON LOWDEN FROM THE PUEBLO OF ACOMA.

THEY TALK ABOUT CLIMATE CHANGE AND STEWARDSHIP, WATERSHEDS, SEEDS AND CULTURE, AND HOW WE FIT INTO THE LANDSCAPES AROUND US.

HOW WE EXIST IN RELATIONSHIP WITH OUR WATERS, LANDS, AND COMMUNITIES.

YOU DON'T HAVE TO BE A MIDDLE SCHOOL STUDENT OR A TEACHER TO LEARN ABOUT THESE THINGS.

ANYONE CAN VISIT NMPBS.ORG/OURLAND, OR YOU CAN GOOGLE PBS LEARNING MEDIA AND OUR LAND.

>> Lou: THANKS, LAURA.

NOW BACK TO OUR DISCUSSION AROUND CAMPAIGN FINANCE AND ITS INFLUENCE ON ELECTIONS NATIONALLY AND HERE IN OUR STATE.

NOW, TRIP, YOU RECENTLY REPORTED ON THE DONORS BEHIND A DARK MONEY GROUP THAT TRIED AND FAILED TO LIMIT THE INFLUENCE OF PROGRESSIVE DEMOCRATS THIS PAST PRIMARY.

THAT GROUP IS CALLED THE NEW MEXICO PROJECT, AND IT'S LED BY ALBUQUERQUE-BASED BUSINESSMAN, FAILED GUBERNATORIAL CANDIDATE, JEFF APODACA.

WHAT DID YOU FIND ABOUT WHO CONTRIBUTED TO THAT GROUP?

>> Jennings: SO, YOU KNOW, WHAT WE FOUND IS LIKE FEWER THAN TEN PEOPLE MADE UP, IT WAS LIKE NINE DONORS, THAT GAVE $141,000 FROM BASICALLY EARLY 2024 THROUGH, MAYBE, MAY -- THE END OF MAY.

AND THE LARGEST CONTRIBUTOR WAS CHEVRON.

THEY'RE THE MAJOR PLAYER.

WE TALKED ABOUT THEM IN THE PREVIOUS SEGMENT.

THERE'S SOME NAMES IN HERE THAT I DIDN'T RECOGNIZE.

ONE NAME THAT I DID RECOGNIZE WHO GAVE $5,000 WAS SAM DONALDSON, WHO IS IN ALBUQUERQUE, OR IS CONNECTED TO NEW MEXICO.

HE GREW UP IN EL PASO, AND HE'S CONNECTED TO NEW MEXICO.

SAM DONALDSON, THE FORMER ABC -- FOLKS -- SOME OF THE YOUNGER VIEWERS WHO DON'T REMEMBER SAM DONALDSON.

BUT THERE'S SOME NAMES OF PEOPLE I DON'T QUITE KNOW.

LIKE A GENTLEMAN FROM ALBUQUERQUE NAMED DOUG CAMPBELL.

HE LISTED HIMSELF AS AN INTERPRETER.

GAVE $25,000.

SO YOU HAD NINE DONORS THAT WERE GIVING UP TO $141,000.

I ALSO WANT TO TALK ABOUT HOW THIS GROUP SPENT MONEY, WHICH WAS ABOUT 110 -- RIGHT AROUND $110,000 -- $121,000 THEY SPENT ALL WENT TO A CORPORATION CALLED 47 LLC, WHICH IS RAN BY JEFF APODACA.

SO, IT WAS VERY INTERESTING TO FIND THAT THE VAST MAJORITY -- IT SEEMS LIKE 90% OF THE EXPENDITURES WENT TOWARD A CORPORATION THAT JEFF APODACA RAN.

THAT WAS REALLY INTERESTING TO SEE THAT.

>> Lou: DEFINITELY.

ERIC, FUNDING TRANSPARENCY, IT'S A PRETTY BIG FOCUS FOR JOURNALISTS.

WE SPEND A LOT OF TIME TALKING ABOUT IT, BUT DO VOTERS CARE ABOUT THIS?

DOES KNOWING WHO IS BEHIND COMMITTEES INFLUENCE VOTER BEHAVIOR?

>> Griego: YOU KNOW, I WAS TRYING TO LOOK AT THE RESEARCH ON THAT, AND IT'S INCONCLUSIVE.

TRANSPARENCY, SUNLIGHT IS ALWAYS A GREAT DISINFECTANT.

AND WE TALK ABOUT THAT.

I THINK THE BIGGER CONCERN THAT HAS BEEN POLLED, PEW AND OTHERS HAVE DONE THIS, IS JUST THE AMOUNT AND THE RULES AROUND GIVING.

I THINK VOTERS HAVE OVERWHELMINGLY ACROSS THE POLITICAL SPECTRUM, OVER 70%, IS LIKE WE HAVE TO DO MORE TO CONTAIN POLITICAL CONTRIBUTIONS AND HOW IT'S AFFECTING AMERICAN POLITICS.

THEY'RE AWARE OF IT.

WHEN YOU'RE ASKED DIRECTLY, LIKE, IS IT A PROBLEM?

ACROSS THE POLITICAL SPECTRUM, PEOPLE THINK WE NEED TO GET MONEY OUT OF POLITICS, OR AT LEAST LIMIT IT.

THE TRANSPARENCY QUESTION HAS NOT BEEN ASKED AS DIRECTLY.

I WOULDN'T SAY THEY DON'T CARE.

I THINK FOR THE AVERAGE VOTER IT'S WHETHER YOU'RE GETTING IT FROM THE LEFT OR THE RIGHT OR A RICH LIBERAL GUY OR RICH CONSERVATIVE GUY, DOESN'T MATTER.

WHAT MATTERS IS IT'S CORRUPTING THE CAMPAIGN.

AND YOU'LL ALSO SEE, I WAS LOOKING AT THE TOP 100 MEGA DONORS, MANY OF THEM GIVE TO BOTH SIDES.

BECAUSE THEY JUST WANT ACCESS, TO AN EARLIER POINT WE WERE TALKING ABOUT -- TRIP WAS TALKING ABOUT THAT.

SO, MOST MEGA GIVING THAT CONCERNS VOTERS IS IDEOLOGICALLY SORT OF DRIVEN.

BUT, THERE ARE A LOT OF FOLKS AND A LOT OF ENTITIES, AND A LOT OF LOBBYISTS -- JUST TO KEEP COPACETIC WITH EVERYBODY, THEY GIVE TO BOTH.

THAT'S A PROBLEM.

IT'S NOT EVEN THE IDEOLOGY, IT'S NOT EVEN A WHO GIVE INTEREST, IT'S THE FACT THAT THEY'RE GIVING SO MUCH AND THEY HAVE WAY MORE ACCESS THAN ANY OF US DO AS INDIVIDUALS, RIGHT?

>> Lou: UNDERSTOOD.

NOW, BACK TO YOU FOR A MOMENT, TRIP.

CAN YOU EXPLAIN THE PROCESS THAT COMPELLED THE NEW MEXICO PROJECT TO DISCLOSE ITS FUNDING SOURCES?

WHAT ROLE DID THE STATE ETHICS COMMISSION PLAY AND WHY DID JEFF APODACA FIGHT SO HARD TO KEEP THOSE RESOURCES HIDDEN?

>> Jennings: I MEAN, YOU KNOW, WE'D PROBABLY HAVE TO TALK TO JEFF APODACA TO REALLY GET THE SENSE OF WHY THEY FOUGHT.

SOME OF THE ARGUMENTS THAT WERE POSED THAT THIS WAS BASICALLY A FREE SPEECH.

YOU KNOW, WE WANTED TO KEEP IT DARK, NOT DISCLOSURE AROUND THIS IS FREE SPEECH, IT'S PROTECTED FREE SPEECH.

THAT'S CONSTITUTIONALLY KIND OF LIKE -- THAT'S NOT A WINNER.

BUT AS TO THE -- HOW THEY WERE FORCED TO DISCLOSE, IT WAS THE STATE ETHICS COMMISSION THAT BASICALLY IN THE END HAD TO SUE THEM, HAD TO GO TO COURT.

THEY WERE, LIKE, YOU NEED TO DISCLOSE THIS.

AND THE STATE ETHICS COMMISSION HAS BEEN THROUGH THIS AND OTHER CASES.

THEY'VE HAD FOUR AGREEMENTS, AS WE COUNT THEM, IN THE PAST THREE OR FOUR YEARS.

AND IT'S BEEN BOTH PROGRESSIVE AND MODERATE TO CONSERVATIVE, YOU KNOW, ENTITIES THAT THEY GOT SETTLEMENTS WITH.

SO, BASICALLY, THEY HAD TO GO TO COURT.

THEY HAD TO TALK TO A JUDGE.

THEY HAD TO PLEAD BEFORE A JUDGE.

THIS IS OUR -- STATE LAWS COMPEL THEM TO BASICALLY BECOME A POLITICAL ACTION COMMITTEE BECAUSE THEY'RE ELECTIONEERING.

THERE ARE CERTAIN THINGS THAT YOU CAN DO -- IF YOU'RE AN EDUCATION KIND OF INSTITUTION, YOU CAN SAY THIS IS ALL ABOUT EDUCATION AND YOU CAN MAYBE REMAIN A NONPROFIT.

BUT IF YOU'RE SAYING VOTE FOR THIS PERSON, OR THINK -- IDENTIFYING CANDIDATES, THAT'S ELECTIONEERING AND UNDER THE LAWS WE'RE WORKING UNDER RIGHT NOW, THAT REQUIRES YOU TO DISCLOSE YOUR SOURCES OF MONEY AND HOW YOU'RE SPENDING THE MONEY.

AND ETHICS COMMISSIONS WERE SUCCESSFUL BEFORE A STATE JUDGE.

AND THE STATE JUDGE COMPELLED THE NEW MEXICO PROJECT TO OPEN ITS BOOKS, WHICH, NO SURPRISE, FEW DONORS AND THE SPENDING WAS INTERESTING.

BUT, YEAH.

>> Lou: WHAT DOES A WIN LIKE THIS DO FOR THE STATE ETHICS COMMISSION IN TERMS OF PERCEPTION OF ITS LEGITIMACY?

>> Jennings: PERSONALLY, I'M GOING TO SAY THE REASON I HAVE THIS OPINION IS BECAUSE I MOVED HERE FROM A STATE THAT HAD A STATE ETHICS COMMISSION THAT HAD BEEN GOING FOR 30-SOMETHING YEARS.

IT PLAYED A PROMINENT ROLE IN A GOVERNOR GOING TO FEDERAL PRISON BECAUSE OF SOME OF THE PAST SCANDALS.

WHEN I MOVED HERE, THEY DIDN'T HAVE A STATE ETHICS COMMISSION.

THEY BASICALLY SPENT 12 YEARS TRYING TO GET IT DONE.

VOTERS VOTED IT IN.

AND THEY'VE BEEN AT WORK FOR ABOUT FOUR OR FIVE YEARS -- I THINK ABOUT FOUR YEARS.

AND THEY'VE GOTTEN SEVERAL AGREEMENTS.

I THINK THIS IS A SERIES OF WINS THAT THE STATE ETHICS COMMISSION HAS -- IS BUILDING ITS INSTITUTIONAL POWER.

AND I'LL SAY THIS, I THINK THAT THE POLITICAL CLASS HERE IN NEW MEXICO IS STILL, PROGRESSIVES, AND CONSERVATIVES AND MODERATES, ARE STILL A LITTLE WEARY OF THE STATE ETHICS COMMISSION BECAUSE THEY THINK THEY'RE GUNNING FOR THEM AND NOT THE OTHERS, WHICH LOOKING AT WHO THE STATE ETHICS COMMISSION HAD AGREEMENTS WITH, THAT'S JUST NOT TRUE.

SO, I THINK IN A DECADE THE STATE ETHICS COMMISSION IS GOING TO SAY, HEY, LOOK, WE'RE NOW PART OF THE NORMAL, BUT THEY'RE STILL BUILDING THAT INSTITUTIONAL POWER.

I THINK THIS IS A BIG WIN.

I DO.

I THINK THAT'S A BIG WIN.

>> Lou: OKAY.

AT THIS POINT, ERIC, HAVE YOU SEEN ENOUGH TO THINK THAT MAYBE THIS WILL HELP CHANGE BEHAVIOR FROM DONORS AND LAWMAKERS KNOWING THAT THE STATE ETHICS COMMISSION DOES HAVE SOME JUICE NOW?

>> Griego: WELL, I THINK PEOPLE WILL PROBABLY BE A LITTLE BIT MORE CAUTIOUS IN TERMS OF HOW THEY'RE REPORTING.

REALLY, ULTIMATELY, THIS IS HOW -- ARE YOU DOING -- ARE YOU REPORTING AND IS THERE ANY REAL TEETH THERE.

I THINK THIS IS A WIN BECAUSE AT LEAST SOMEBODY'S PAYING ATTENTION.

BUT, LOOK, THIS IS NOT A PARTISAN ISSUE.

THIS HAPPENS ACROSS THE POLITICAL SPECTRUM.

IT'S THE RULES OF THE GAME, YOU KNOW?

AND EVERYBODY PLAYS IT.

MEANING, EVERYBODY'S GOING TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO RAISE MONEY TO SUPPORT THEIR CAUSE OR SUPPORT THEIR CANDIDATE, OR THE CANDIDATES WHO SUPPORT THEIR CAUSES.

SO, IF NOBODY'S -- IF THERE IS NO OVERSIGHT, THEN IT'S JUST GOING TO GET WORSE.

I WOULD LIKE TO SEE -- I WAS IN THE SENATE WHEN WE FIRST STARTED TRYING TO RUN THIS LEGISLATION, AND IT WAS A LIFT.

BY THE WAY, IT WASN'T A PARTISAN ISSUE.

BOTH PARTIES WERE NOT CRAZY ABOUT IT.

SOME INDEPENDENT LEGISLATORS WERE, BUT YOU KNOW, THIS IS -- MONEY IS THE LIFEBLOOD OF POLITICS.

IT'S ALSO, I THINK, POISONING OUR POLITICS.

AND TO TRIP'S POINT, WHO EXACTLY WAS GOING TO BE ON THIS AND WHO WERE THEY GOING TO GO AFTER, RIGHT?

BUT EVEN LEFT TO RIGHT, I MEAN, THE FOLKS WHO ARE GOOD AT USING MONEY TO ADVANCE THEIR AGENDA CERTAINLY DON'T WANT THESE FACELESS FOLKS OVERSEEING WHAT THEY'RE DOING AND SECOND GUESSING THEM.

BECAUSE I KNOW -- YOU KNOW, THE GAME IS THE GAME.

AND, YOU KNOW, THE RULES ARE THE RULES.

AND ACROSS THE POLITICAL SPECTRUM PEOPLE ARE GOING TO PLAY BY WHATEVER THE RULES ARE.

WE NEED TO CHANGE THE RULES FOR EVERYBODY, BUT UNTIL WE DO THAT, REPUBLICANS, DEMOCRATS, PROGRESSIVES, CONSERVATIVES ARE GOING TO TRY TO MAXIMIZE THEIR INFLUENCE UNDER THE CURRENT SYSTEM.

AND ANYBODY WHO SORT OF GETS IN THE WAY OF THAT, YOU KNOW, IS GOING TO BE SUSPECT.

YOU'RE NOT GOING TO DISCREDIT THEM, BUT CERTAINLY THEY DON'T WANT TO BE TOLD HOW TO WIN THEIR RACES OR WIN THEIR ISSUES, RIGHT?

>> Lou: SURE.

SURE, IT'S ALL IN THE GAME.

I WANT TO CIRCLE BACK AROUND TO VOTERS ONCE MORE AS WE WRAP UP HERE.

AND I CAN START WITH YOU, TRIP, GIVE YOU A CRACK IN A SECOND, ERIC.

WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THEM AS THESE STAGNANT BEINGS THAT CAN BE PUSHED OR PULLED, BUT SHOULD THERE BE ANY RESPONSIBILITY FOR VOTERS TO DO THEIR OWN RESEARCH TO FIND OUT WHO IS TRYING TO INFLUENCE THEM BEFORE THEY HEAD TO THE POLLS?

OR IS THAT TOO COMPLEX OF A TASK FOR THE AVERAGE VOTER?

>> Jennings: I WANT TO SAY THAT THE SECRETARY OF STATE'S OFFICE HAS IN THE PAST FEW YEARS HAS UPDATED ITS WEBSITE THAT SHOWS, YOU KNOW, WHO IS RAISING THE MOST MONEY AND STUFF LIKE THIS.

I THINK THEY'RE WORKING ON AN UPDATE ON THAT.

I THINK THAT'S HELPFUL, TO YOUR POINT, THAT I THINK THERE'S A MOVE BY GOVERNMENT ORGANIZATIONS AND MEDIA ORGANIZATIONS TO TRY TO MAKE IT SIMPLER.

BECAUSE IT IS TERRIBLY COMPLEX BECAUSE YOU CAN DOWNLOAD ALL THE CONTRIBUTIONS IN THIS CYCLE, ALL THE PEOPLE, AND YOU'LL GET A TOTAL -- THIS IS JUST EXAMPLE OF HOW COMPLEX IT IS.

BUT YOU HAVE TO UNDERSTAND THAT TOTAL YOU GET COUNTS ONE DOLLAR MULTIPLE TIMES.

YOU CAN'T TRUST THAT TOTAL.

SO MEDIA ORGANIZATIONS LIKE OURS AND OTHERS ARE TRYING TO MAKE IT SIMPLER FOR VOTERS.

THEY SHOULD DO THEIR OWN RESEARCH, BUT THEY SHOULD ALWAYS HAVE THIS THOUGHT IN THEIR MIND THAT THERE'S A LOT WE DON'T KNOW.

THERE'S A LOT WE DON'T KNOW, AND MAYBE WE SHOULD TALK TO PEOPLE OR LISTEN TO FOLKS, MEDIA ORGANIZATIONS, GO TO THE SECRETARY OF STATE'S OFFICE WHO DO THIS KIND OF WORK TO HELP THEM FIGURE THIS STUFF OUT.

BUT, I MEAN, WE DO THIS WORK AND THERE'S A LOT WE DON'T KNOW, HONESTLY.

>> Lou: SURE.

WHAT RESPONSIBILITY DO VOTERS HAVE?

>> Griego: YOU KNOW, WE HAVE A PROBLEM JUST GETTING PEOPLE TO VOTE.

WITH ALL KIND OF DUE RESPECT TO OUR DEMOCRACY AND INDIVIDUAL RESPONSIBILITY, I THINK IT IS THE MEDIA'S ROLE.

I THINK ACROSS THE -- AGAIN, ACROSS THE SPECTRUM, SMALL, INDEPENDENT MEDIA, BUT CERTAINLY THE BIG STATEWIDE MEDIA, THERE'S NOT ENOUGH ATTENTION GOING INTO WHO IS GIVING TO CAMPAIGNS, HOW MUCH IS BEING GIVEN TO CAMPAIGNS, WHAT ISSUES AND ANALYSIS.

I THINK IT IS A ROLE FOR THEM.

THAT'S WHY WE NEED A STRONG, ROBUST MEDIA.

BECAUSE WITHOUT IT, WITHOUT IT, WE DON'T -- THE AVERAGE VOTER, YOU KNOW, WITH A JOB AND A FAMILY AND GETTING INTO THE POLLS IS PROVEN HARD ENOUGH.

ASKING THEM TO FIGURE OUT WHO IS PAYING FOR THE CANDIDATES AND I THINK IS WELL-INTENTIONED, BUT I DON'T THINK IT'S REALISTIC.

I JUST DON'T THINK IT IS.

SO, THE MEDIA REALLY HAS TO STEP IT UP.

AND I THINK TRIP IS DOING SOME GOOD WORK, AND SOME INDEPENDENT JOURNALISTS ARE DOING GOOD WORK.

BUT WE NEED TEN MORE LIKE THEM.

>> Jennings: AGREED.

>> Lou: ABSOLUTELY.

YEAH, SAME.

UNM POLITICAL SCIENCE PROFESSOR, FORMER STATE SENATOR, ERIC GREIGO, THANK YOU SO MUCH.

TRIP JENNINGS, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF NEW MEXICO IN DEPTH, THANKS A LOT.

>> Jennings: THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

>> Jeff: MANY THANKS TO LOU, TRIP, AND ERIC.

NOW, NEXT WEEKEND NEW AND EXPECTING PARENTS HAVE A CHANCE TO GET CONNECTED WITH THE SUPPORT AND RESOURCES THEY NEED TO START PARENTHOOD ON THE RIGHT FOOT.

ALBUQUERQUE'S MAIN LIBRARY IS HOSTING A COMMUNITY BABY SHOWER.

ONE OF TWO EVERY YEAR.

AS COORDINATOR DEBORAH HASSI TELLS LOU, IT'S AN OPPORTUNITY TO LEARN AND FEEL MORE COMFORTABLE ENTERING ONE OF THE MOST STRESSFUL AND REWARDING UNDERTAKINGS OF A PERSON'S LIFE.

>> Lou: DEBORAH HASSI, FROM ALBUQUERQUE'S MAIN LIBRARY, THANK YOU FOR JOINING ME ON NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS.

>> Hassi: I'M HAPPY TO BE HERE.

THANK YOU.

>> Lou: YEAH.

SO, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE COMMUNITY BABY SHOWERS PROGRAM.

IT'S HAPPENING FOR THE SECOND TIME THIS YEAR, COMING UP IN OCTOBER.

WHAT WAS THE INSPIRATION BEHIND THIS PROGRAM?

HOW DID IT START?

>> Hassi: SO, ONE OF THE -- THE MISSION OF THE PUBLIC LIBRARY IS CONNECTING PEOPLE WITH SERVICES AND RESOURCES.

AND WE KNOW THAT PEOPLE HAVE BABIES EVERY DAY, AND WE WANT TO BE ABLE TO FILL THAT NEED FOR, GOSH, I'M EXPECTING A BABY WHAT HAPPENS NOW.

WHO DO I TALK TO?

WHAT SERVICES CAN I CONNECT WITH?

SO, WHAT HAPPENED WAS BACK IN 2013 MY SUPERVISOR CAME TO ME AND SAID I THINK WE SHOULD START A COMMUNITY BABY SHOWER TO CONNECT EXPECTING FAMILIES WITH SERVICES AND RESOURCES THAT MIGHT BE USEFUL TO THEM.

BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU DON'T KNOW UNTIL YOU FIND OUT.

SO, RECRUITING PARTNERS WAS A LONG PROCESS, BUT WE ARE -- WE GOT A WELL, MATURE PROGRAM AND WE ARE -- EVERY YEAR WE DO THIS EVENT TWICE A YEAR.

AND WE BRING IN PARTNERS WITH A HEALTH OR SOCIAL SERVICE FOCUS FOR YOUNG FAMILY, AND WE GIVE THEM A VENUE TO TALK TO PEOPLE WHO ARE EXPECTING OR MAYBE HAVE HAD A CHILD THAT MAYBE WANT TO DO SOMETHING A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT THIS TIME AROUND.

AND WE, YOU KNOW, PROVIDE THEM WITH THAT CONNECTION.

KIND OF LIKE A, YOU KNOW, SPEED DATING KIND OF THING.

>> Lou: GREAT.

NOW, AS A NEW PARENT MYSELF, I'M A NEW PARENT ALSO, I KNOW IT CAN BE STRESSFUL.

I MIGHT PREFACE MANY QUESTIONS WITH THAT.

BUT, WHEN YOU WALK IN TO THIS EVENT ON OCTOBER 19th, I KNOW IT CAN BE INTIMIDATING TO THINK ABOUT ALL THIS INFORMATION OUT THERE.

WHAT CAN SOMEONE EXPECT, AND HOW CAN YOU EASE THEIR MIND ABOUT THAT?

>> Hassi: SO, IT'S A VERY CASUAL -- THERE'S NO REGISTRATION.

EVERYONE CAN JUST COME IN.

IT'S SET UP LIKE AN INFO FAIR.

SO, IF YOU'VE EVER BEEN TO, SAY, A JOB FAIR, OR BRIDLE EXPO, IT'S SET UP VERY SIMILAR TO THAT.

YOU CAN TALK TO THE AGENCIES THAT YOU'D LIKE TO TALK TO.

YOU CAN SKIP THE ONES THAT YOU DON'T.

IF YOU'VE ALREADY HAD YOUR BABY, YOU DON'T NEED TO TALK TO A MIDWIFE OR A DOULA.

SO YOU DON'T NEED TO TALK TO THOSE AGENCIES.

YOU CAN SKIP THOSE.

THERE'S A LOT OF GIVEAWAYS.

THERE'S A LOT OF FREEBIES.

WE KEEP THINGS FUN AND CASUAL.

IT'S SET UP LIKE A PARTY.

DECORATIONS, REFRESHMENTS.

IT'S NOT REALLY HIGH-STRESS, AND THERE'S NO FEE TO GET IN.

AND WE'RE ALL HAPPY TO SEE EVERYONE COME IN.

>> Lou: NOW, I WANT TO SPEND SOME TIME TALKING ABOUT THE NEED THAT THESE SHOWERS ARE ADDRESSING.

YOU MENTIONED IT'S BEEN AROUND FOR TEN YEARS NOW.

WHY ARE THEY NECESSARY?

AND WHO EXACTLY ARE YOU SERVING AT YOUR BRANCH IN ALBUQUERQUE, IN PARTICULAR?

>> Hassi: SO WE TARGET THIS ALL OVER THE CITY.

WE BOUNCE THIS EVENT AROUND.

WE HAVE IT TWICE A YEAR.

WE BOUNCE IT AROUND TO SOME OF OUR LARGER BRANCHES AROUND THE CITY.

THIS TIME IT HAPPENS TO BE AT THE MAIN LIBRARY DOWNTOWN.

AND IT'S TARGETED TO ANYONE WHO IS A FIRST-TIME PARENT, PARENTS OF PARENTS WHO ARE SUPPORTING THE EXPECTING PARENTS, PEOPLE WHO HAVE HAD TWO OR THREE BABIES, MAYBE WANT TO TRY SOMETHING A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT THIS TIME AROUND.

MAYBE THEIR FIRST BABY WAS IN A HOSPITAL SETTING, MAYBE THEY WANT TO TRY A DOULA OR MIDWIFE THIS TIME AROUND.

IT'S FOR ANYONE WHO DOESN'T KNOW WHAT THEY DON'T KNOW ABOUT THE PROCESS OF EXPECTING, DELIVERING, AND POSTPARTUM WITH HAVING A NEW LITTLE ONE IN THEIR LIVES.

SO, IT'S FOR EVERYONE.

IT REALLY TARGETS THE LOWER INCOME STRATA WHO, YOU KNOW, MIGHT NOT HAVE THE FRIENDS AND FAMILY SUPPORT THAT, YOU KNOW, THEY MIGHT HAVE OTHERWISE.

BUT IT'S REALLY FOR EVERYONE, REGARDLESS OF INCOME LEVEL OR ZIP CODE, OR ANYTHING.

SO, IT'S OPEN TO THE PUBLIC AND WE WELCOME EVERYONE.

WHATEVER STAGE OF PREGNANCY OR DELIVERY THEY'RE AT.

>> Lou: OKAY.

I KNOW, BEING A PARENT, YOU NEED A LOT OF STUFF FOR THE BABY.

YOU MENTIONED SOME GIVEAWAYS, WHAT KIND OF THINGS ARE BEING GIVEN?

>> Hassi: SO, EVERYONE WHO IS A PARTNER, WHO IS A PARTNER AGENCY, WILL GIVE LITTLE GIVEAWAYS THEY MIGHT HAVE.

SOMETHING THAT MIGHT BE CONNECT WOULD THE SERVICES THEY PROVIDE.

THEY MIGHT HAVE A DEMONSTRATION THAT THEY PROVIDE.

AT ONE SHOWER, WE HAD A MASSEUSE.

IT DOESN'T HAPPEN EVERY TIME, YOU KNOW, THE PARTNERS DO CHANGE FROM SHOWER TO SHOWER.

BUT THERE ARE LITTLE GIVEAWAYS.

NO ONE IS GIVING AWAY CAR SEATS, UNFORTUNATELY.

THOSE ARE PRETTY EXPENSIVE.

BUT, YOU KNOW, LITTLE GIVEAWAYS THAT, YOU KNOW, MIGHT BE SUPPORT TO, YOU KNOW, WHAT THE NEW FAMILY NEEDS.

SOME OF THE PARTNERS DO A LITTLE DIAPER CAKE RAFFLE AT THEIR LITTLE TABLE.

SO, YOU KNOW, THEY UNDERSTAND THAT THERE ARE A LOT OF NEEDS IN A YOUNG PARENT'S LIFE.

SO, YEAH, OUR PARTICIPANTS CAN GO AWAY WITH BAGS FULL OF GOODIES.

>> Lou: OKAY.

CAR SEATS, THE LIST GOES ON.

THESE THINGS DO COST A LOT OF MONEY.

ARE THERE RESOURCES THERE FOR FINANCIAL ASSISTANCE FOR PEOPLE WHO MIGHT NEED IT ALSO?

>> Hassi: SOME OF OUR PARTNERS DO PROVIDE RESOURCES EITHER ON A SLIDING SCALE OR ON REASONABLY PRICED STANDPOINT.

>> Lou: OKAY.

>> Hassi: IT VARIES.

IT REALLY DEPENDS ON WHAT THE SERVICE IS.

AND WE DON'T VOUCH FOR ANY OF THE SERVICES.

OUR CONNECTION WITH THE COMMUNITY IS FREE.

THE PARTNERS THAT DO COME IN MAY CHARGE, DEPENDING ON WHAT THE SERVICE IS.

BUT SOME OF THEM DO OFFER SCHOLARSHIP PROGRAMS, SOME OF THEM OFFER GRANT OPPORTUNITIES, SO IT'S WORTH A FAMILY'S WHILE TO SPEAK TO THE AGENCIES AND SEE WHAT MIGHT BE AVAILABLE FOR THEM.

>> Lou: SURE.

SAY, I CAN'T MAKE IT OCTOBER 19th, BUT I REALLY DO WANT TO GET CONNECTED WITH THESE RESOURCES, HOW COULD I DO THAT?

>> Hassi: WELL, WE OFFER IT TWICE A YEAR.

AND SO IF YOU MISS THIS SHOWER, WHETHER WHATEVER STAGE OF PREGNANCY YOU'RE AT OR DELIVERY, THERE'S GOING TO BE ANOTHER ONE IN THE SPRING.

SO SPRING AND FALL, SPRING AND FALL IS WE ALWAYS HAVE THOSE.

AND ANYONE WHO, YOU KNOW, MISSED THE SHOWER, WE HAVE THE RESOURCES FROM THE AGENCIES THAT HAVE COME IN, CONTACT INFORMATION.

ANYONE WHO VISITS US AFTERWARDS AND WOULD LIKE TO GET CONNECTED WITH PARTICULAR AGENCIES THAT MAYBE THEY WANTED TO TALK TO BUT THEY MISSED, WE CAN CONNECT THEM AFTERWARDS.

>> Lou: GREAT.

>> Hassi: JUST UPON REQUEST.

>> Lou: NOW, IN THE YEARS SINCE THIS PROGRAM STARTED, HOW HAVE THE NEEDS AND QUESTIONS FROM YOUNG FAMILIES AND NEW PARENTS CHANGED?

HAVE THEY EVOLVED OVER THESE TEN YEARS?

>> Hassi: WELL, I THINK THE BIGGEST THING IS THE ECONOMIC STANDPOINT.

PREGNANCY HAS REMAINED UNCHANGED FOR, YOU KNOW, A LONG TIME.

AND, SO, HOW FAMILIES CAN ADDRESS THAT FINANCIALLY, I MEAN EVERYTHING THAT WE DO HAS BECOME MORE EXPENSIVE.

AND BRINGING A NEW LIFE INTO THE WORLD IS ONE OF THOSE THINGS.

AND, SO, I THINK THAT'S PROBABLY THE BIGGEST IMPACT THAT IT'S HAD ON YOUNG FAMILIES IS HOW ARE WE GOING TO AFFORD TO BRING THIS NEW LITTLE ONE INTO THE WORLD AND RAISE HIM OR HER TO A MANNER THAT THEY DESERVE.

SO, THAT'S PROBABLY THE BIGGEST IMPACT.

FROM MY VIEW ON THE SIDELINES, AS WE'RE JUST THE VENUE FOR THESE THINGS, PEOPLE ARE GOING TO GET FEEDBACK THAT'S WHERE THEY ARE.

THEY'RE GOING TO ASK THE QUESTIONS AND THE AGENCIES THAT ARE MOST SUITED TO THEM ARE GOING TO BE THE ONES THAT ARE GOING TO BE THE ONES TO GIVE THEM THE BEST ANSWERS.

>> Lou: OKAY.

NOW, YOU MENTIONED FEEDBACK, WHAT TYPE OF FEEDBACK HAVE YOU GOTTEN FROM NEW PARENTS OVER THE YEARS?

IS THIS SOMETHING THAT YOU'VE HEARD AFTER THE FACT THAT HAS REALLY HELPED PEOPLE?

>> Hassi: YES, ABSOLUTELY.

THEY ARE VERY GRATEFUL FOR THE OPPORTUNITY TO HAVE ALL OF THESE DIFFERENT AGENCIES THAT REPRESENT A WIDE VARIETY OF SERVICES.

HEALTH, SOCIAL SERVICE, MENTAL SUPPORT.

AT ONE TIME WE EVEN HAD AN AGENCY WHO WAS SUPPORTING FAMILIES WHO LOST THEIR BABIES.

AND, SO, WE HAVEN'T HAD THAT ONE IN A WHILE.

BUT THAT WAS A PRETTY GOOD ONE.

SO, IF THEY'RE LISTENING, GIVE ME A CALL.

WE ARE HAPPY TO BRING ALL OF THESE DIFFERENT AGENCIES TOGETHER IN ONE PLACE.

AND I THINK THE FAMILIES ARE REALLY APPRECIATIVE THAT THEY DON'T HAVE TO GO FROM PLACE TO PLACE TO PLACE TO PLACE, ALL OVER THE CITY, TO GET THE INFORMATION THEY NEED.

OR MAYBE THAT THEY DIDN'T KNOW THEY NEEDED, BUT IT'S ALL IN ONE ROOM.

AND THEY CAN VISIT AS LONG AS THEY LIKE TO WITH THOSE DIFFERENT AGENCIES AND GET THE INFORMATION THAT THEY NEED.

>> Lou: GREAT.

NOW, WHEN YOU BRING IN NEW FAMILIES, OF COURSE, READING FOR YOUNG KIDS IS VERY IMPORTANT.

HOW DO YOU ENCOURAGE FAMILIES TO START ON THAT PATH TO GET THEIR KID READING YOUNG AND TO KEEP THAT GOING?

>> Hassi: TWO OF THE TABLES WE HAVE AT OUR EVENTS, EVERY EVENT, THE FIRST IS THE SPONSOR, THE PUBLIC LIBRARY FOUNDATION.

THEY HAVE BEEN JUST MONUMENTALLY IMPORTANT IN MAKING SURE WE CAN KEEP THE FUNDING FOR THIS PROGRAM GOING AND THE SUPPORT FOR THIS PROGRAM GOING.

ONE OF THEIR MAJOR FOCUSES OF THE FOUNDATION IS ON LITERACY.

FAMILY LITERACY, EARLY LITERACY, AND WAYS TO SUPPORT THAT THROUGH ALL AGES, STAGES OF LIFE.

FROM, YOU KNOW, EVEN BEFORE A BABY IS BORN, THEY CAN HEAR IN THERE.

AND ALL THE WAY THROUGH SENIOR AGE.

AND, SO, WE WANT TO HAVE ACTIVITIES FOR THOSE FAMILIES AND PEOPLE WHO WOULD USE THE LIBRARY.

AT WHATEVER STAGE OF LIFE THEY'RE IN.

AND WE ALSO HAVE THE PUBLIC LIBRARY AS A SYSTEM HOSTS ITS OWN TABLE TO TALK ABOUT THE EVENTS, NOT JUST THE COMMUNITY BABY SHOWER, BUT EVENTS GOING ON WITH THE LIBRARY SYSTEM ALL THROUGH THE YEAR.

MANY PEOPLE DON'T REALIZE THAT WE HAVE 19 LOCATIONS ALL OVER ALBUQUERQUE AND BERNALILLO COUNTY.

AND THERE'S ONE LIKELY NEAR WHERE YOU LIVE IN THIS AREA.

AND MANY PEOPLE AREN'T EVEN SURE THAT THERE WAS A LIBRARY NEARBY WHERE THEY LIVE.

SO WE LIKE TO GET THE WORD OUT, AND A WHOLE MENU OF DIFFERENT SERVICES AND PROGRAMS AND SPECIAL THINGS THAT ARE GOING ON FOR LOW OR NO COST.

ALMOST EVERYTHING WE DO IS NO COST TO THE COMMUNITY.

AS WITH BOND FUNDING AND TAX FUNDING, YOU KNOW, WE'RE GRATEFUL FOR THAT SUPPORT.

SO, WE HAVE SO MUCH GOING ON.

ALL IT TAKES IS JUST A CONVERSATION WITH OUR LIBRARY REPRESENTATIVE TO LEARN WHAT THOSE THINGS ARE.

SO, ONCE THE LITTLE ONE IS BORN, WE CAN GET THEM INVOLVED IN STORY TIMES AND AFTER-SCHOOL ACTIVITIES AND MAKE LIFELONG READERS OUT OF THEM.

THAT'S OUR GOAL.

>> Lou: FANTASTIC.

DEBORAH HASSI, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR BEING HERE ON NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS.

>> Hassi: IT WAS MY PLEASURE.

THANK YOU.

>> Jeff: THANKS TO DEBORAH HASSI, THE PUBLIC LIBRARY FOUNDATION, AND EVERYONE ELSE THAT CONTRIBUTED TO THE SHOW.

THANK YOU FOR WATCHING, AND WE'LL SEE YOU AGAIN NEXT WEEK.

>> FUNDING FOR NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS IS PROVIDED BY VIEWERS LIKE YOU.