FUNDING FOR NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS PROVIDED BY VIEWERS LIKE YOU.

>> Gene: THIS WEEK ON NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS, DUMPING GROUND DEADLINE APPROACHES.

A FEDERAL COMMISSION IS NEARING A DECISION THAT COULD SEND THOUSANDS OF TONS OF NUCLEAR WASTE TO OUR STATE.

PLUS -- >> WHEN YOU'RE ADDICTED YOU NARROW LIKE YOUR VIEW OF THE WORLD AND BASICALLY YOUR LIFE REVOLVES AROUND THAT.

>> Gene: REFRAMING MINDS, A UNIVERSITY DOCTOR TELLS US HOW MDMA ASSISTED THERAPY IS HELPING PATIENTS OVERCOME TRAUMA DRIVEN ADDICTION.

NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS STARTS NOW.

THANKS FOR JOINING US THIS WEEK.

I'M YOUR HOST, GENE GRANT.

GOVERNOR MITCHELL LUJAN GRISHAM IS DECLARING A STATE OF EMERGENCY IN SANDOVAL COUNTY OVER A RUSH OF FLOODWATERS IN THE JEMEZ RIVER.

IN ABOUT 25 MINUTES I ASK OUR LINE OPINION PANEL IF THE OVERWHELMING SNOW SMELT CAUSING THAT FLOODING COULD BRING LONG-TERM BENEFITS.

IN THE SECOND HALF OF TODAY'S SHOW, I SIT DOWN WITH FILMMAKER BEHIND A NEW DOCUMENTARY ABOUT ROBERT OPPENHEIMER.

WRITER AND CREATOR LARRY SHEFFIELD EXPLAINS WHY HE WANTED TO FOCUS ON THE PHYSICIANS' LIFE AFTER HE CREATED THE ATOMIC BOMB.

THAT IS IN LESS THAN 40 MINUTES, BUT FIRST THE STATE'S RECREATIONAL CANNABIS MARKET IS CELEBRATING ITS FIRST BIRTHDAY THIS MONTH.

LET'S GET TO THE LINE.

WELCOME TO OUR LINE OPINION PANELISTS FOR THE WEEK.

HAPPY TO BE JOINED IN PERSON IN OUR ALBUQUERQUE STUDIOS BY ANDY LYMAN, A STAFF WRITER FOR THE SANTA FE REPORTER.

SHAUN GRISWOLD IS HERE, HE IS EDITOR AT SOURCE NEW MEXICO.

REALLY PLEASED TO HAVE FORMER STATE SENATOR DEDE FELDMAN WITH US AGAIN AS WELL.

THANK YOU ALL FOR BEING HERE.

THINGS ARE LOOKING GREEN FOR THE CANNABIS INDUSTRY HERE IN NEW MEXICO.

IT HAS BEEN ONE YEAR SINCE RECREATIONAL PRODUCTS HIT SHELVES ACROSS THE STATE BRINGING IN MORE THAN 300 MILLION IN TAXABLE SALES SINCE LAST APRIL.

NOW, ANDY, YOU WROTE SEVERAL WONDERFUL STORIES FOR A SPECIAL ISSUE OF THE SANTA FE REPORTER THIS WEEK EXAMINING TRENDS THAT HAVE EMERGED IN THE YEAR SINCE LEGALIZATION.

YOU PROFILED A SMALL FAMILY OWNED CANNABIS BUSINESS AND THEY VOICED A COMMON CONCERN OF LATE OVER SATURATION IN THE MARKET.

I HEAR THIS A LOT FROM A LOT OF DIFFERENT ANGLES.

WE'LL TALK ABOUT THIS.

YOUR TAKEAWAY ON THIS FIRST BIT ABOUT OVERSATURATION.

TRUE, FALSE?

PEOPLE PROTECTING MARKETS?

>> Andy: I THINK IT IS SORT OF A NATURAL CONSEQUENCE OR BENEFIT TO THE WAY THE STATE HAS BEEN ISSUING LICENSES AND I THINK PART OF THE WAY THEY HAVE BEEN ISSUING LICENSES, OR THE REASON THEY HAVE, IS SORT OF HELPING PEOPLE THAT BASICALLY EVERYONE THAT WANTS A LICENSE, THEY'LL HELP GET A LICENSE.

THE STATE, I MEAN.

PART OF THAT, AT LEAST THE NOTION THERE, IS THAT IT IS PART OF THAT EQUITY THING, LIKE WE WANT TO MAKE SURE EVERYBODY WANTS A LICENSE GETS ONE AND PUT EVERYONE ON AN EVEN PLAYING FIELD.

WHAT THAT CREATES OBVIOUSLY IS EVERYONE HAS A LICENSE, EVERYONE CAN OPEN A RETAIL SPOT, ASSUMING THEY HIT THE BENCHMARKS FOR THE CITIES THAT THEY ARE IN, BUT WHAT THAT CREATES IS LIKE WHO IS GOING TO MAKE IT, WHO IS NOT?

IN SANTA FE, IT DOESN'T SEEM LIKE IT WOULD BE AS SATURATED.

IF YOU DRIVE AROUND ALBUQUERQUE, THEY ARE EVERYWHERE.

>> Gene: IT IS UNBELIEVABLE.

>> Andy: PER CAPITA, SANTA FE IS RIGHT THERE.

IF YOU LOOK AT A MAP, SORRY, RLD, DIVISION OF LICENSING DEPARTMENT, HAS A MAP OF THE WHOLE STATE WHERE YOU CAN SEE WHERE ALL THE SHOPS ARE.

AND THEY ARE ALL JUST RIGHT ALONG CERRILLOS.

THERE IS SORT OF A CLUSTER DOWNTOWN SANTA FE AND THEN JUST ALL DOWN CERRILLOS UNTIL YOU GET TO I-25.

>> Gene: WHAT ARE WE TALKING ABOUT FOR CURRENTLY LICENSED FOLKS?

HOW MANY ARE THERE OUT THERE IN THE STATE RIGHT NOW?

>> Andy: ALTOGETHER LICENSES WAS SOMETHING LIKE 2,000.

I WANT TO SAY IT IS AROUND 400 AS FAR AS RETAIL SPOTS.

I COULD BE WRONG ON THAT.

>> Dede: 630 THEY SAID.

>> Andy: KEEP IN MIND THAT IS LICENSES.

THAT DOESN'T NECESSARILY MEAN THEY ARE OPEN.

SOME PEOPLE MIGHT BE IN THE MIDDLE OF THEIR GROW TRYING TO GET THINGS READY, BUT THERE IS A LOT OF LICENSES OUT THERE.

DIFFERENT KINDS.

>> Gene: I WANT TO TALK ABOUT THIS EQUITY PROVISION.

ANDY, START WITH YOU.

INTERESTING LAWMAKERS REPEATEDLY SAID WOULDN'T HAVE LEGALIZED CANNABIS WITHOUT AN EQUITY PROVISION.

REMEMBER THOSE HEARINGS AND JAVIER -- THIS IS A BIG DEAL AND HAS THE STATE DONE ENOUGH IN YOUR VIEW, SENATOR, TO MAKE SURE COMMUNITIES AFFECTED BY THE WAR ON DRUG, THIS IS WHAT OSTENSIBLY THE DEAL WAS, ARE WE GETTING TO SOME EQUITY PLACE NOW IN YOUR VIEW?

>> Dede: IT IS HARD TO TELL FROM MY POINT OF VIEW.

ANDY MAY KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION.

BUT IT WAS -- THIS PROVISION WAS INTENDED TO ADDRESS THE RAVAGES BROUGHT ON BY THE WAR ON DRUGS AND PEOPLE THAT SERVED TIME AND THE PEOPLE WHOSE FAMILIES AND LIVES WERE REALLY DESTROYED UNNECESSARILY BY THIS KIND OF UNJUST THING.

NOW, THE CRITERIA FOR GETTING SORT OF SPECIAL PERMISSION UNDER THESE LICENSES IS PRETTY BROAD.

I MEAN IT IS NOT -- DOESN'T JUST SEEM TO APPLY TO THOSE PEOPLE WHO WERE PREVIOUSLY INCARCERATED OR ANYTHING.

IT IS PEOPLE WHO ARE LOW INCOME, PEOPLE WHO ARE FROM A RURAL AREA.

>> Gene: THAT IS ALL IT TAKES.

>> Dede: PEOPLE OF CERTAIN ETHNIC AND RACIAL -- I THINK THAT MIGHT BE PRETTY HARD TO ADMINISTER FOR THE REGULATION AND LICENSING AND IT MIGHT TAKE A LOT OF TIME TO DO THAT.

I REALLY DON'T KNOW HOW THAT IS GOING AND WHAT PERCENTAGE OF LICENSES ARE DUE TO THAT PROVISION.

>> Goodbody: GOOD POINT.

EXCELLENT POINT.

SHAUN, AT SOURCE, GOT TO ASK, CITY OF ALBUQUERQUE MADE NOISE ABOUT GOING BEYOND WHAT IS IN STATE LAW TO ENSURE THAT EQUITY WE ARE TALKING ABOUT, CREATING THE CANNABIS EQUITY WORKING GROUP IN 2021, BUT ACCORDING TO REPORTING FROM YOUR SHOP, SOURCE NEW MEXICO, THE CITY HASN'T RESPONDED TO A 21-PAGE RECOMMENDATION REPORT SUBMITTED TO THE MAYOR'S OFFICE LAST SPRING.

THAT IS A WHOLE YEAR.

WHAT HAPPENED HERE?

WHAT IS GOING ON?

>> Shaun: YEAH, IT IS INTERESTING.

THE REPORT WAS COMPILED BY BLACK AND BROWN WOMEN THAT WORK THAT ARE CONTRACTED BY THE CITY OF ALBUQUERQUE THROUGH THE CITY EQUITY OFFICE REPORTED TO THE MAYOR'S.

SAT ON THE MAYOR'S DESK FOR 18 MONTHS AND MONDAY WAS THE FIRST TIME CITY COUNCILORS WERE GIVEN A REVIEW OF THE ACTUAL REPORT.

THE REPORT DOES RECOMMEND, AS ANDY WAS DISCUSSING, OUTLINES FOR HOW THE CITY CAN PROMOTE AND ENCOURAGE PEOPLE FROM MARGINALIZED COMMUNITIES TO RECEIVE BUSINESS LICENSES OR GROWING LICENSES TO GET THEIR FOOT IN THE DOOR IN THE INDUSTRY.

THERE IS EFFORTS ON EXPUNGEMENT AND WHAT PEOPLE NEED TO DO TO GET THEIR RECORD CLEARED, WHICH TO THE STATE LEGISLATURE'S CREDIT, THAT WAS VERY INSTRUMENTAL IN LEGALIZING RECREATIONAL CANNABIS WAS, WITHOUT THE PROVISION OF EXPUNGEMENT FOR CRIMINAL RECORDS, THE STATE WASN'T GOING TO LEGALIZE RECREATIONAL CANNABIS.

SO, TO THE STATE'S CREDIT, THEY DO HAVE THAT BUILT IN BUT THERE IS STILL A CONCERN FROM PEOPLE WHO HAVE THOSE RECORDS, WHAT IS THE PROCESS I NEED TO DO?

HOW CAN HE ENSURE TO EMPLOYERS THIS ISN'T ON MY RECORDS?

SO THE CITY HOPES TO PROVIDE RESOURCES THAT ACTUALLY DOES OUTREACH TO INDIVIDUALS.

BUT THE OTHER QUESTION HERE TOO IS, AND I THINK THIS IS HAPPENING ACROSS THE STATE WITH HOW MUCH MONEY -- ALL THE STATE -- ALL THE TAX REVENUE THE STATE IS RECEIVING FROM CANNABIS SALES AND RECREATIONAL CANNABIS SALES IS GOING TO THE GENERAL FUND.

THIS EQUITY GROUP IS ALSO REQUESTING MONEY NOT GO TO DIRECTLY TO THE GENERAL FUND OR IF IT IS, A PORTION GO TO SOME OF THESE SERVICES THAT NOT ONLY LET THEM BUILD BUSINESSES WITH SOME OF THESE PEOPLE WHO ARE GENERALLY LEFT OUT OF THE INDUSTRIES, THE EXPUNGEMENT PROCESS, BUT ALSO LOOKING AT SUBSTANCE USE ISSUES AND PROVIDING MENTAL HEALTH SUPPORT FOR INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE STRUGGLING WITH ADDICTION ISSUES.

>> Gene: BEFORE I GET TO YOU ON THIS, THIS IS AN INTERESTING POINT.

MOVING MONEY INTO THE GENERAL FUND.

>> Dede: THAT IS WHERE IT IS GOING NOW.

IT IS GOING TO THE GENERAL FUND NOW WITH, I GUESS, A PORTION OF THE TAX REVENUE GOING TO LOCAL GOVERNMENT.

A THIRD OF IT OR SOMETHING.

SO, YEAH, I MEAN THIS IS ALWAYS A BIG ISSUE WITH NEW REVENUE STREAMS.

SHOULD IT BE EARMARKED FOR A CERTAIN PURPOSE THAT MIGHT BE RELATED TO THE ISSUE OR SHOULD IT GO INTO THE GENERAL FUND WHERE LEGISLATORS HAVE MORE AUTHORITY TO APPROPRIATE IT AND USE IT AS THEY SEE FIT.

SO, IT IS AN OLD STORY BUT IT CERTAINLY SEEMS TO ME THAT THIS CRIES OUT FOR SOME SORT OF EAR MARKING.

>> Gene: AN INTERESTING POINT.

I WANT TO COME BACK TO THE EAR MARKING.

ANDY, THE RECOMMENDATIONS IN THAT REPORT INCLUDED FUNDING FOR CANNABIS SOCIAL EQUITY PROGRAMS.

WE ALL KNOW ABOUT THAT.

REINVESTMENT OF CANNABIS TAX REVENUE, AS SENATOR MENTIONED, EFFECTIVE ACCOUNTING OF ENVIRONMENTAL AND WATER IMPACTS.

DURING THE RUN UP TO THIS, WE HEARD A LOT ABOUT WATER IMPACTS, NOT SO MUCH NOW.

AND THE PUBLISHING OF CANNABIS RELATED ARRESTS AND CITATIONS FROM APD.

THAT IS ACTUALLY VERY INTERESTING.

AGAIN THE NATURE OF THE ARGUMENT HERE, GIVE US A SENSE OF WHAT IS THE PUSH AND PULL HERE?

HOW FAR ARE PEOPLE WILLING TO GO HERE?

>> Andy: I GUESS I DON'T KNOW.

TO JUMP OFF WHAT SHAUN WAS TALKING ABOUT IN THE SOURCE STORY THAT AUSTIN FISHER WROTE, THAT IS AN OVERLOOKED PIECE OF EQUITY, YOU KNOW, THE OBVIOUS ONE IS WHO GETS A LICENSE, WHO GETS A CHANCE TO GET FOOT IN THE DOOR IN THIS BUT IT'S ALSO FOR GROUPS SUCH AS DRUG POLICY ALLIANCE, THEY ARE SAYING A BIG PIECE OF EQUITY IS TO SORT OF HELP THOSE PEOPLE THAT WERE IMPACTED BY THE WAR ON DRUGS OR DRUGS IN GENERAL, RIGHT, WHICH IS REHAB OR PREVENTION, DRUG PREVENTION STUFF.

SO, I GUESS I AM SORT OF LOST ON WHY, EVEN IN SANTA FE, THEY ARE SAYING, YOU KNOW, OVER HALF A MILLION DOLLARS WE WANT TO KEEP IT IN THE GENERAL FUND.

WE DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH MONEY THIS IS GOING TO PROVIDE AND SO I AM NOT QUITE CLEAR ON WHY THERE IS SUCH A HESITANCY TO PUT THAT MONEY SOME PLACE.

>> Dede: IT MAY BE BECAUSE THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT THE YEAR OVER YEAR REVENUE IS GOING TO BE AND WHETHER THERE HAS BEEN A BIG, YOU KNOW, BURST AT THE BEGINNING OF THIS PROGRAM AND IT WILL GO DOWN IN THE FOLLOWING YEARS.

>> Gene: LET ME GET YOU TO STAY ON THAT SUBJECT AND WE CAN ALL TOUCH ON THIS.

THE IDEA HERE, THERE WOULD BE ENOUGH JOBS AND ENOUGH INCOME AND ENOUGH EVERYTHING TO START TO MOVE AWAY FROM OIL AND GAS.

WERE WE TOO ANXIOUS ON THAT?

THAT IS A LOT OF MONEY 300 MILLION, BUT IT IS NOT A LOT OF MONEY AT THE END OF THE DAY COMPARED TO OIL AND GAS.

>> Dede: IT IS NOT.

I DON'T THINK IT WAS EVERY REALLY TOUTED AS A SUBSTITUTE FOR OIL AND GAS BUT AS ONE -- AS A PIECE OF ONE ALTERNATIVE PICTURE TO OIL AND GAS AND WE NEED TO CONTINUE TO BUILD THAT ALTERNATIVE PICTURE.

>> Gene: DO WE KNOW, ANDY, HOW MANY JOBS ARE CURRENTLY BEING FILLED OR OPERATING IN THIS?

THE GOVERNOR I SEEM TO RECALL THE NUMBER WAS 11,000 BACK WHEN.

>> Andy: I THINK IT IS HOW BROAD YOU WANT TO LOOK, BECAUSE THERE IS ANCILLARY BUSINESSES, TOO, RIGHT.

THERE IS A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT ARE SAYING, OH, WE'LL DO MARKETING FOR YOU.

WE'LL CREATE THE LEADERBOARDS FOR YOUR STORES, WE'LL DO SECURITY.

WE'LL BE YOUR REALTOR TO FIND A BUILDING AND THEN, OF COURSE, IF YOU ARE VERTICALLY INTEGRATED IN AN ACTUAL CANNABIS COMPANY, YOU COULD HAVE JOBS ANYWHERE FROM GROWING TO RETAIL AND ANYWHERE IN BETWEEN AND MARKETING SO I THINK IT IS HARD TO GET A REAL IDEA OF HOW MANY JOBS THERE ARE THERE.

>> Gene: FAIR ENOUGH.

WHAT IS THE DEAL WITH DELIVERY.

A LOT OF PEOPLE UNDERSTAND THERE IS DELIVERY AVAILABLE FOR RECREATIONAL MARIJUANA AND SOME PEOPLE ARE LIKE I HAVE NEVER HEARD OF THIS, WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT?

IN YOUR REPORTING HAVE YOU COME UP ON ANYTHING.

CURIOUS ABOUT THE APD ARRESTS AND CITATIONS.

WHAT IS GOING ON WITH ALL THAT?

>> Shaun: WELL, THROUGH ANDY'S REPORTING WE FOUND OUT THAT THE STATE HAS LICENSED OVER 30 COURIERS.

NOW THE STATE ALREADY HAD A COURIER SYSTEM DEVELOPED UNDER THE MEDICAL MARIJUANA PROGRAM AND THAT WAS CONSIDERED LIKE ONE OF THE BEST WAYS TO PROVIDE ACCESS TO RURAL MEDICAL PATIENTS, TO THEIR MEDICINE.

SO, JUMPING OFF OF THAT, I BELIEVE THAT IS ALSO THE EFFORT WHEN IT COMES TO COURIERS IS THAT YOU'RE PROVIDING ACCESS TO CANNABIS TO PEOPLE WHO DON'T NECESSARILY HAVE A DISPENSARY OR FIVE DISPENSARIES ON THEIR BLOCK.

SO THAT IS AN EFFORT THERE THAT I THINK IS GROWING AND COULD HONESTLY BOOST IN NEW MEXICO AS ANOTHER JOB THAT COULD PROVIDE MORE REVENUE FOR A PRIVATE COMPANY THAT DOESN'T HAVE TO HAVE A MARIJUANA LICENSE, MAYBE A PARTICULAR COURIER LICENSE, WHICH I AM STILL UNSURE IF THAT EVEN EXISTS BECAUSE THEN THERE IS ALSO THE COURIER ELEMENT OF HOW DO YOU TRANSPORT YOUR MONEY BACK AND FORTH.

THERE IS NOT NECESSARILY A BRINKS FOR MARIJUANA, THE BIG ARMORED CARS, AND THAT LEADS TO SOME SORT OF FEDERAL ISSUES REGARDING HOW MONEY IS TRANSFERRED.

TRANSPORTATION IS ANOTHER ELEMENT THAT WE ARE ACTUALLY LOOKING INTO TO SEE WHAT IS INVOLVED WHEN IT COMES TO NOT ONLY MOVING THE CASH SUPPLY, WHICH IS THE PREDOMINANT AMOUNT LIKE THE SOURCE OF REVENUE THAT DISPENSARIES HAVE, BUT ALSO YOUR INVENTORY.

OR, YOU KNOW, INVENTORY OF YOUR PACKAGING MATERIAL.

OR JUST HOW DO YOU GET YOUR PRODUCT OVER TO A CUSTOMER WHO LIVES HUNDREDS OF MILES AWAY IN A RURAL COMMUNITY.

THAT IS A FASCINATING ELEMENT TO SEE NEW MEXICO POTENTIALLY GROW INTO AS WE SEE MORE JOBS COME OUT OF THIS INDUSTRY.

>> Gene: NICE WRAP UP THERE.

INTERESTING.

WHEN YOU GO UP 4TH STREET YOU MIGHT AS WELL CALL IT CANNABIS ROW.

IT'S AMAZING.

THE STATION AT MENAUL AND 4TH.

IT IS A DRIVE UP.

YOU CAN DRIVE UP NOW AND PLACE YOUR ORDER AND GET IT.

>> Andy: MENAUL IS ANOTHER ONE.

THAT IS THREE MILES IN ALBUQUERQUE THAT IS NOT REALLY NEAR SCHOOLS OR CHURCHES AND STUFF.

>> Gene: FASCINATING.

IMAGINE THIS ALL STARTED WITH THE IDEA TO DO STATE RUN POP SHOPS AND HERE WE ARE.

THANKS TO OUR LINE OPINION PANEL.

WE'LL MEET BACK HERE AT THE TABLE IN LESS THAN 15 TO TALK ABOUT SOME PRESSING ENVIRONMENTAL CONCERNS IN OUR STATE INCLUDING NUCLEAR WASTE DISPOSAL PLAN AND HISTORIC FLOODING IN THE JEMEZ RIVER VALLEY.

>> DR. OPPENHEIMER IS -- IT IS AN AMERICAN STORY.

IT IS A STOREY ABOUT WHERE HE IS MINDING HIS OWN BUSINESS TEACHING IN BERKELEY AND HE GETS APPROACHED ABOUT THIS, YOU KNOW, THING THAT IS OF A NATIONAL CONCERN.

HE WANTS TO DO HIS PATRIOTIC DUTY AND THEN, YOU KNOW, IT IS THE AMERICAN STORY ABOUT THE POWER AND THE GREED IN SOME WAYS, YOU KNOW, ONCE DESTROYING THE VERY THING THAT HE CREATED.

>> GENE: OPIOID ADDICTION HAS DESTROYED LIVES AND FAMILIES ACROSS THE COUNTRY AND HERE IN NEW MEXICO.

IT IS A CRISIS UNM HOSPITAL'S MILAGRO PROGRAM FOCUSED ON ESPECIALLY FOR EXPECTANT MOTHERS WHO ARE ADDICTED.

THE GOAL IS TO BREAK THE CYCLE OF DEPENDENCY BUT THE PROGRAM'S MEDICAL DIRECTOR, DR. LARRY LEEMAN, SAYS METHADONE AND BUPRENORPHINE TREATMENTS AREN'T ALWAYS SUCCESSFUL.

THAT IS WHY DR. LEEMAN IS ABOUT TO LAUNCH A FIRST OF ITS KIND STUDY TO ADDRESS UNDERLYING MENTAL TRAUMAS THAT FEED ADDICTION.

THE PROGRAM USES MDMA, A DRUG POPULARLY KNOWN AS ECTASY OR MOLLY, BUT AS DR. LEEMAN TELLS SENIOR PRODUCER LOU DIVIZIO, WHEN GIVEN IN A CONTROLLED SETTING, IT HELPS MOM'S OVERCOME TRAUMA DRIVEN ADDICTION AND IMPROVE THEIR THE BOND WITH THEIR CHILD.

>> Lou: I WANT TO TALK ABOUT HOW YOU GOT INVOLVED WITH THE MILAGRO PROGRAM TO BEGIN WITH.

WHAT MADE YOU WANT TO WORK WITH EXPECTANT MOTHERS?

>> Leeman: SURE.

SO I WAS ORIGINALLY TRAINED AS A FAMILY MEDICINE PHYSICIAN AND THEN I DID SOME ADDITIONAL TRAINING IN OBSTETRICS AND WE HAD A WHOLE MATERNAL-CHILD HEALTH PROGRAM WHERE WE WERE TAKING CARE OF MOTHERS AND BABIES.

AND PEOPLE THOUGHT THAT WAS A GREAT MODEL TO GET INVOLVED WITH THE OPIOID POPULATION.

SO INITIALLY I TOOK CARE OF THE BABIES FOR A FEW YEARS AND THEN, YOU KNOW, I WAS INVITED TO BE THE MEDICAL DIRECTOR OF MILAGRO.

THAT IS 12 YEARS AGO.

STARTED DOING THAT WORK.

THAT WAS -- THAT KIND OF NATURALLY LED INTO ACTUALLY THIS WORK, BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, WHAT I LEARNED FROM THAT IS I LEARNED MORE THAT THE HEART OF ADDICTION IS ACTUALLY TRAUMA AND WOUNDING THAT HAS OCCURRED.

AND, YOU KNOW, DOING WORK LIKE THE STUDY ACTUALLY DOES, THE FIRST ONE IS TO LOOK AT MEDICATIONS THAT CAN ACTUALLY HELP PEOPLE PROCESS THEIR TRAUMA.

>> Lou: ONE OF THE MEDICATIONS USED RIGHT NOW IS METHADONE.

ARE THERE ANY DRAWBACKS TO THAT TYPE OF TREATMENT?

>> Leeman: YEAH.

THERE IS TWO MAIN MEDICINES.

THERE IS METHADONE AND BUPRENORPHINE.

METHADONE, IT IS GREAT, YOU KNOW, FOR PEOPLE TO BE GETTING OFF OF HEROIN, FENTANYL, OXYCODONE.

METHADONE IS VERY RESTRICTED SO PEOPLE HAVE TO GET DOSES EITHER EVERYDAY OR THEY CAN GET SOME TAKE HOME, SO THEY ARE TIED INTO THE SYSTEM THERE.

SOME PEOPLE FIND THEY HAVE SIDE EFFECTS WITH METHADONE AND THEY FEEL SEDATED FROM DOING THAT.

BUPRENORPHINE, A LITTLE BIT MORE FLEXIBILITY, ESPECIALLY IN A STATE LIKE NEW MEXICO, YOU CAN GET IT PRESCRIBED AT A 30-DAY SUPPLY.

SO IF YOU LIVE IN SILVER CITY OR THE REZ, THAT IS MORE CONVENIENT FOR MOST PEOPLE.

>> Lou: HOW CAN PSYCHODELIC TREATMENTS BE MORE EFFECTIVE?

>> Leeman: SO IT IS A DIFFERENT PARADIGM THAN BUPRENORPHINE OR METHADONE.

WE ARE NOT USING A REPLACEMENT THERAPY.

WHAT WE ARE DOING IS REALLY A ONE-TIME TREATMENT WITH PEOPLE WHERE THEY WILL GO THROUGH A 12-WEEK THERAPY TIME, THEY'LL HAVE -- WE CALL IT MD MAIN ASSISTED THERAPY.

AND I THINK THAT IS IMPORTANT.

IT IS NOT THAT THE MEDICINE ITSELF, YOU KNOW, CAN CURE ADDICTION OR TRAUMA.

IT CAN ALLOW FOR THE THERAPY THEREIN AND WHAT IT DOES IS IT TEMPORARILY SUPPRESSES THE FEAR.

LIKE WHEN PEOPLE HAVE HAD TRAUMA CAUSED PTSD, THERE IS LOTS OF THINGS THAT TRIGGER THINGS, THINGS IN THEIR LIFE THAT TRIGGERS THINGS, AND THE ACTUAL IDEA OF PROCESSING THAT TRAUMA IS REALLY SCARY FOR PEOPLE.

>> Lou: YOU MENTIONED TRAUMA.

CAN YOU NAIL THAT DOWN.

HOW IMPORTANT IS IT TO GET TO THAT BEFORE WE SEE ANY OTHER SIGNS OF PROGRESS IN TERMS OF DEPENDENCY?

>> Leeman: LET ME SHARE A LITTLE BIT HOW THE MDMA THERAPY WORKS.

THE PEOPLE THAT ARE ELIGIBLE FOR THIS STUDY HAVE OPIOID USE DISORDER.

THEY ARE STABILIZED ENOUGH TO DO THE THERAPY WHICH MEANS METHADONE OR BUPRENORPHINE AND THEN THEY HAVE HAD CHILDREN WITHIN THE LAST SIX TO 12 MONTHS.

AND SO THE REASON THERE ARE FOLKS IN THIS POPULATION, THEY HAVE BOTH PTSD AND MEET THE CRITERIA FOR MODERATE TO SEVERE OPIOID USE DISORDER.

SO WHAT THEY DO IN THE STUDY, THEY'LL HAVE THREE SESSIONS WITH A THERAPIST, A THERAPIST TEAM.

THAT TEAM IS SORT OF TO ESTABLISH THE BACKGROUND, ESTABLISH A TRUST THAT IS IMPORTANT DURING THE EXPERIMENTAL SESSIONS.

MY EXPERIENCE AS AN MDMA THERAPIST IS THAT OFTEN GOES DEEPER, GOES INTO WOUNDING THAT HAPPENS IN CHILDHOOD, WHETHER IT IS ACTUALLY ABUSE OR NEGLECT.

AND SO IT GOES BACK INTO WHAT WE CALL -- SOMETIMES WE TALK ABOUT TRAUMA AS BIG T AND LITTLE T. BIG T IS SOMETHING LIKE A MILITARY TRAUMA, EXPOSED TO SOMEBODY IN THE FAMILY BEING KILLED WITH VIOLENCE, SEXUAL ABUSE.

THERE IS LITTLE TRAUMA THAT CAN HAPPEN IF YOUR PARENTS WERE ADDICTED TO HEROIN AND YOU DIDN'T GET THE SAME AMOUNT OF CARE SO THERE IS SOMETHING CALLED INTERGENERATIONAL TRAUMA AND WE ARE HOPING THIS HELPS WITH INTERGENERATIONAL TRAUMA AS WELL.

>> Lou: HOW DOES THE IDEA OF CONNECTION PLAY INTO THIS AND WHY IS IT SO IMPORTANT FOR ALL PEOPLE BUT FOR MOTHERS SPECIFICALLY?

>> Leeman: THAT IS A GREAT QUESTION.

SO, WHEN WE TALK ABOUT CONNECTION, SOME PEOPLE DESCRIBE AND I THINK THIS IS ACCURATE, THAT CONNECTION IS ALMOST THE OPPOSITE OF ADDICTION.

WHEN YOU'RE ADDICTED YOU NARROW YOUR VIEW OF THE WORLD AND BASICALLY SOMETHING LIKE HEROIN OR FENTANYL, YOUR LIFE REVOLVES AROUND THAT, AND YOU NARROW DOWN YOUR RELATIONSHIPS.

PEOPLE WHO DON'T USE ARE LARGELY BEING CUT OFF FROM PEOPLE AND SO IT IS A VERY NARROW RESTRICTED WAY OF BEING.

BY LOOKING AT CONNECTION, WE ARE TALKING ABOUT MULTIPLE LEVELS.

LIKE ONE CONNECTION IS SIMPLY WHAT IS YOUR CONNECTION TO FAMILY, PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY, PEOPLE THAT SUPPORT YOU?

SOME OF IT IS MORE INTERNAL, WHAT IS YOUR CONNECTION TO YOURSELF?

KIND OF YOUR OWN INTERNAL PROCESSES AND SOME OF IT IS BROADER, ACTUALLY CONNECTION TO THINGS LIKE THE NATURAL WORLD, GOING OUT HIKING, ALL THOSE CAN BE PART OF THE HEALING PROCESS.

THE CLASSIC PSYCHODELIC THINGS LIKE PSILOCYBIN WORK VERY DIRECTLY ON AFFECTING INTERCONNECTIVES IN THE BRAIN AND IN THE OUTER LEVEL.

MDMA WORKS A LITTLE DIFFERENT.

>> Lou: WITH A MOTHER SPECIFICALLY AND THE CONNECTION WITH HER CHILD, HOW WILL THIS TREATMENT HELP IN THAT PROCESS?

IS THAT AN IMPORTANT THING THAT YOU NEED TO HELP WITH.

>> Leeman: WE THINK SO.

SO THIS IS RESEARCH SO WE DON'T REALLY KNOW WHAT WE ARE GOING TO FIND OUT BUT THE HYPOTHESIS HERE IS ABOUT HALF OF PEOPLE WE SEE WITH OPIOID USE DURING THE PREGNANCY HAVE PTSD AND PROBABLY MORE IF YOU INCLUDE THE LITTLE T TRAUMA.

SO WE ARE HYPOTHESIZING THAT MDMA, WHICH APPEARS IN OTHER STUDIES TO BE EFFECTIVE FOR PTSD, BY TREATING THE PTSD, WE'LL DECREASE THE LIKELIHOOD THAT THE PERSON RELAPSES.

WHAT WE SEE IS AFTER THE PREGNANCY, 50% OR MORE PEOPLE BY A YEAR LATER HAVE STARTED USING.

THEY ARE BACK TO HEROIN OR FENTANYL AND SUCH AND THAT IS HOW I GOT INTERESTED IN DOING THIS.

I WAS DOING PREGNANCY CARE, I WOULD TAKE CARE OF PEOPLE, WE GET THROUGH THE PREGNANCY, THEY GET STABLE IN THE POSTPARTUM AND THEN I WOULD THINK THINGS WERE GOING WELL AND I WOULDN'T SEE THEM BECAUSE WE HAD DONE THAT AND YEAR-AND-A-HALF LATER THEY ARE BACK USING HEROIN, PREGNANT AGAIN.

AND I SAW THAT OVER AND OVER AGAIN, EVENTUALLY, YOU KNOW, I THOUGH MAYBE I AM NOT GETTING AT THE HEART OF THIS.

SO THE HOPE IS THAT BY TREATING THE PTSD WILL AFFECT THE RESUMPTION OF THE OPIOID USE BUT ALSO WHEN PEOPLE HAVE HAD TRAUMA, IT AFFECTS THEIR ABILITY, YOU KNOW, CONNECTION TO BE ABLE TO CONNECT WITH PEOPLE.

ONE OF THE MOST DEEPEST CONNECTIONS IS MATERNAL BONDING CONNECTION.

SO THAT IS ONE THING WE ARE GOING TO STUDY AND LOOK AT HOW THE PEOPLE ARE BONDING WITH THEIR BABY, HOW ARE THEY DOING THAT, AND HOW DOES THAT CHANGE DURING THE STUDY AND THE HOPE IS THAT IT WILL HELP WITH WHAT IS BROADLY CALLED MATERNAL INFANT ATTACHMENT.

AND THAT IS ONE OF THE FACTORS THAT WE THINK IS PART OF THE INTERGENERATIONAL TRAUMA.

PART OF IT IS LIKE IF YOU GROW UP IN A FAMILY WHEN THERE IS ACTIVE USE, PART OF IT IS IF YOU HAVE BEEN EXPOSED TO YOUR OWN TRAUMA, BUT PART OF IT APPEARS TO BE TRANSMITTED THROUGH THE MOTHERS.

AND THAT CAN HAPPEN AT LEVELS FROM GENETICS, WHAT IS CALLED EPIGENETICS, AND IT CAN HAPPEN ALSO THROUGH THE WAY THAT PEOPLE RELATE TO ATTACHMENT.

>> Lou: CAN YOU EXPLAIN WHY PEOPLE CAN'T DO THIS THEMSELVES?

WHY THIS NEEDS TO BE IN A CONTROLLED SETTING.

YOU CAN'T JUST GO REFRAME YOUR OWN MIND.

>> Leeman: THANKS SO MUCH FOR BRINGING THAT UP.

FIRST OF ALL, IF THEY ARE DOING IT THEMSELVES, THEY PROBABLY ARE USING STREET DRUGS.

THE STREET DRUGS THAT ARE SOLD AS MDMA, ECSTASY, AND MOLLY, BY AND LARGE THEY MAY OR MAY NOT HAVE MDMA, THEY ARE CONTAMINATED WITH AMPHETAMINES AND OTHER SUBSTANCES.

SO THEY WON'T ACTUALLY BE THE DRUG, BUT THERE IS WHAT WE CALL THE CONTAINER.

AND THE THERAPIST ARE REALLY GOOD CONTAINERS, SO THAT BEFORE THEY ENTER THE EXPERIMENTAL SESSION, THEY'LL HAVE HAD THREE SESSIONS BEFORE THE FIRST ONE WITH A THERAPIST TEAM.

WE'LL BE THERE FOR THE WHOLE TIME WITH THEM AND SO WE ESTABLISH A TRUST DURING THAT TIME.

ONCE YOU HAVE THE TRUST THERE AND YOU HAVE THE USE OF THE MDMA, IT IS NOT A VERY DIRECTED THERAPY.

I AM NOT SITTING THERE WHILE THEY ARE DOING MDMA SAYING TALK TO ME ABOUT YOUR TRAUMA.

WE ARE THERE FOR THEM AND WHAT HAPPENS IS WHEN YOU TAKE AWAY THAT DEEP FEAR TRIGGERS WITH MDMA, PEOPLE NATURALLY WANT TO TALK ABOUT THEIR TRAUMA.

THEY HAVE BEEN PREPPED FOR THE IDEA THIS IS A SAFE PLACE TO TALK ABOUT THAT.

WHILE THEY ARE DOING THE MDMA THEY'LL USUALLY START OUT WITH EYE SHADES AND HEADPHONES AND INITIALLY GO WITHIN.

AND OFTEN WHAT HAPPENS, THEY'LL GO BACK AND RELIVE SOME OF THE SCENES IN TRAUMA AND MULTIPLE TIMES DURING THE SESSION, WHICH LASTS ABOUT FIVE HOURS, THEY'LL COME OUT, TAKE THEIR EYE SHADES OFF AND THEY ARE THERE FOR WHATEVER THEY WANT.

IF THEY WANT TO TALK AND THEY WANT TO TALK THROUGH THE TRAUMA.

>> Lou: WHEN WILL YOUR STUDY BEGIN?

THE MDMA STUDY.

>> Leeman: YEAH, WE WILL BE IN ABOUT THREE OR FOUR MONTHS.

WE HAVE A COUPLE OF -- IT IS QUITE A TIERED PROCESS.

YOU NEED TO GET APPROVAL BY FDA, APPROVAL BY UNM.

THE DA WILL VISIT US IN A MONTH OR TWO AND LOOK AT THE FACILITIES.

WE'RE STILL IN THE FUND RAISING PROCESS.

THIS STUDY IS ACTUALLY RATHER UNIQUE.

MDMA HAS BEEN USED IN DIFFERENT WAYS AROUND THE WORLD.

THIS IS ACTUALLY THE FIRST STUDY THAT WILL BE DONE FOR OPIOIDS, ONLY THE SECOND STUDY IN THE WHOLE WORLD AS FAR AS WITH SUBSTANCE USE.

THEY HAVE DONE SOME WORK WITH ALCOHOL AND SO THIS REALLY IS SORT OF A UNIQUE OPPORTUNITY FOR US TO ACTUALLY SEE DOES THIS WORK?

DOES ACTUALLY TREATING PTSD WITH MDMA HELP THAT PART OF IT?

>> Lou: DO YOU THINK A SUCCESSFUL STUDY LIKE THIS COULD HELP PEOPLE UNDERSTAND THAT, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN CHANGE IF YOU'RE -- YOU CAN CHANGE YOUR MIND TO BECOME A BETTER VERSION OF YOURSELF.

MAYBE THAT IS NOT THE BEST WAY TO PHRASE IT BUT ABLE TO CHANGE YOUR MIND.

HOW IMPORTANT IS IT FOR PEOPLE TO KNOW THAT IS POSSIBLE.

>> Leeman: YEAH, THAT IS A BEAUTIFUL QUESTION.

I THINK THE KEY PART OF HOW DOES MDMA WORK.

AND I THINK WHAT IT DOES IS ALLOWS PEOPLE TO REFRAME THEIR MEMORIES, KIND OF UNDERSTAND THEIR MEMORIES FROM A DIFFERENT POINT OF VIEW, UNDERSTAND WHAT IS THEIR POTENTIAL.

IT GIVES THEM A GLIMPSE OF, FOR A FOUR TO SIX HOUR PERIOD, LIVING WITHOUT THAT FEAR, LIVING WITHOUT THOSE TRIGGERS.

AND SO THAT CAN HELP MODEL, BUT WHAT IS HAPPENING IS THEY ARE BRINGING UP THEIR TRAUMAS AND THERE IS A CERTAIN BEAUTY AT SEEING THIS PROCESS AND SEEING SOMEONE WHO CAME TO SEE US FOR A RELATIONSHIP TRAUMA AND BY THE END OF THE THIRD SESSION, THEY ARE PROCESSING THROUGH THEIR DEEPER CHILDHOOD ISSUES.

AND PEOPLE HAVE SAID, WHICH I THINK IS ACCURATE, IS THERE IS A POTENTIAL TO ACHIEVE THE SAME THING THAT MAY TAKE MANY YEARS IN OTHER THERAPIES, IN A RELATIVELY SHORT TIME WINDOW.

SO, WE ARE EXCITED TO HAVE THIS HAPPENING HERE IN NEW MEXICO.

>> Ricks: SPACE IS SO BIG THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE SAY THAT IT MAKES THEM FEEL INSIGNIFICANT.

WE ARE VERY TINY IN THE GRAND SCHEME OF THINGS BUT BEING ABLE TO LOOK OUT AND SEE SOME OF THESE THINGS THAT ARE SO FAR AWAY, SO BIG, THE SCALE OF THIS IS SO UNIMAGINABLE, AND YET WE ARE ABLE TO TAKE PART IN THAT.

WE ARE PART OF THAT AND SO, IN ONE SENSE YOU FEEL SMALL.

IN ANOTHER SENSE YOU FEEL BIG AND THIS IS KIND OF MAGIC.

>> Gene: WELCOME BACK TO THE LINE OPINION PANEL.

NEW MEXICO SITS AT A CROSSROADS THIS WEEK, AS THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT DECIDES THE FATE OF ONE TOXIC WASTE SITE AND CONSIDERS PLANS FOR ANOTHER.

THE FEDS NEED STATE APPROVAL TO KEEP THE WASTE ISOLATION PILOT PLANT, KNOWN AS WIPP, UP AND RUNNING FOR THE NEXT 10 YEARS.

ACCORDING TO SOURCE NEW MEXICO, THE SITE'S CURRENT PERMIT CALLS FOR THE PLANT TO CLOSE NEXT YEAR AND A FEDERAL REPORT SAYS THAT THE WIPP DISPOSAL SPACE COULD RUN OUT OF SPACE BY 2025.

RIGHT AROUND THE CORNER.

THIS IS ALL HAPPENING AS FEDERAL OFFICIALS CONSIDER LICENSING ANOTHER NUCLEAR WASTE SITE IN SOUTHEAST NEW MEXICO.

NOW, IF THAT IS APPROVED, HOLTEC INTERNATIONAL WOULD OPEN A MULTIMILLION DOLLAR DUMPING GROUND THAT COULD HOLD NEARLY 9,000 METRIC TONS OF SPENT NUCLEAR WASTE.

WHEN WIPP BEGAN OPERATING HERE IN NEW MEXICO, WE OPENED THE DOORS FOR THIS STATE TO BE WHERE THE REST OF THE COUNTRY STORES WASTE THEY DON'T WANT.

SENATOR, AM I RIGHT ON THAT AND ARE WE ABOUT TO TAKE A CORNER TO BE JUST KNOWN AS THE DUMPING GROUND FOR THE REST OF THE COUNTRY?

HATE TO START OUT WITH SUCH A STARK QUESTION BUT A LOT OF FOLKS ARE VERY AFRAID OF THAT.

>> Dede: I THINK THE CIVIC LEADERS FROM SOUTHEAST NEW MEXICO LITERALLY SOLICITED THE HOLTEC PLANT TO COME TO THAT AREA USING THE ARGUMENT THAT WE ARE WILLING TO DO THIS, WE ARE TRAINED.

WE KNOW THE ROPES.

IT IS REALLY UNFORTUNATE, I THINK, FOR THE REST OF THE STATE BECAUSE OF THE TRANSPORTATION ISSUE.

THIS STUFF HAS TO BE TRANSPORTED TO THIS REMOTE LOCATION THROUGH NEW MEXICO.

AND, OF COURSE, THERE IS A BIG DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE TWO FACILITIES.

ONE IS PUBLIC AND ONE IS PRIVATE.

ONE IS -- HOLTEC IS TO HOUSE VERY, VERY DANGEROUS, HIGH LEVEL WASTE AND THE OTHER, WIPP, IS MORE LONG LASTING TRANSURANIC WASTE THAT IS MAYBE NOT QUITE SO DANGEROUS IMMEDIATELY, BUT IT IS GOING TO LAST 250,000 YEARS.

>> Gene: IF THOSE BARRELS DON'T GIVE WAY FIRST UNDERGROUND AND WE HAVE HAD THAT TALK HERE AT THIS TABLE CERTAINLY.

ANDY, INTERESTINGLY STANDING IN THE WAY OF THE PROPOSED HOLTEC SITE, THE SENATOR MENTIONED, IS A NEW BILL THE GOVERNOR SIGNED LAST MONTH AND AS YOU KNOW BLOCKS THE FEDS FROM CREATING A HIGH LEVEL WASTE SITE WITHOUT STATE APPROVAL, BUT THAT LEGISLATION DOESN'T GO INTO EFFECT UNTIL JUNE 15 AND THE NRC SAYS IT COULD MAKE ITS DECISION IN MAY.

A BIT OF A DILEMMA HERE.

HOW MUCH TEETH DOES THAT ACTUALLY HAVE?

WHAT WAS PASSED IN SANTA FE TO STOP THIS?

>> Andy: I THINK AGAIN TIMING WISE, IT WOULD HAVE HAD A LOT MORE TEETH IF IT WAS, BUT THAT IS ALSO SORT OF THE NATURE OF THE LEGISLATURE.

THAT IS JUST, THERE IS A TIME LINE OF THINGS THAT HAPPEN.

I GUESS, AND MAYBE THE SENATOR COULD SPEAK ON THIS BETTER, BUT I WOULD IMAGINE THAT THERE IS SOME SORT OF PROVISION OF, OKAY, NOW THE LAW IS IN EFFECT.

I DON'T KNOW.

THAT CREATES A WHOLE MESS OF UNTANGLING THERE, I THINK.

>> Gene: THEY ARE TRYING TO GET IN FRONT OF IT.

THE GOVERNOR IS TRYING TO GET IN FRONT OF THIS AND OTHERS.

IS IT FUTILE, THIS BILL THAT WAS PASSED IN THE LEGISLATURE?

>> Dede: I THINK IT IS A GOOD THING THAT BILL PASSED OUT OF THE LEGISLATURE.

THE ATTORNEY GENERAL HAS ALSO WEIGHED IN WITH THE GOVERNOR.

GOVERNOR SIGNED IT RIGHT AWAY THE NEXT DAY.

AS A SIGNAL THAT THIS IS REALLY IMPORTANT BEFORE THE NRC INEVITABLY, IN MY VIEW, ISSUES ITS PERMIT.

THE EPA ONE IS PENDING, A LITTLE BIT LONGER TERM.

AND THIS IS GOING TO GIVE -- THIS IS GOING TO CREATE A LOT OF PROBLEMS FOR HOLTEC.

AND I DON'T THINK -- AND PARTICULARLY BECAUSE IT IS A PRIVATE FACILITY RATHER THAN A DOE FACILITY.

>> Gene: THERE IS OVERSIGHT ISSUES.

THERE IS ALL KINDS OF ISSUES OF PRIVATE VERSUS -- >> Dede: IN SOME WAYS IT HAS MORE OF A HANDLE ON IT, BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO ISSUE BUILDING PERMITS, DO TRANSPORTATION PERMITS.

THERE IS A WHOLE BUNCH OF STUFF.

IF YOU WANT TO BUILD ANYTHING IN NEW MEXICO, YOU GOT TO JUMP THROUGH A LOT OF HOOPS NOT JUST ENVIRONMENTAL ONES.

>> Gene: SHAUN, INTERESTINGLY THERE IS A FUNDAMENTAL QUESTION.

SENATOR MENTIONED THE FOLKS DOWN IN THIS PART OF THE EDDY LEA COUNTY ACTIVELY SEEKING TO BRING FOLKS IN.

ARE THEY CHOOSING ECONOMIC GROWTH OVER HEALTH AND SAFETY OF THEIR FOLKS DOWN THERE?

>> Shaun: IT APPEARS THAT ECONOMIC GROWTH IS IMPACTFUL AND IT IS PART OF HOLTEC'S PLAN.

THEY ARE SAYING THEY ARE GOING TO BE OFFERING MORE THAN 250,000 JOBS, $75,000 JOBS.

>> Gene: A LOT OF MONEY.

>> Shaun: WELL, I DON'T KNOW, I MEAN, THERE IS A LOT OF OIL AND GAS MONEY THAT PAID AT THE BEGINNING.

THAT IS WHAT WE WERE DISCUSSING EARLIER WITH THE SENATOR WAS, WHEN THIS STARTED IN 1999 OR A LITTLE YEARS BEFORE THAT, AS THEY WERE SOLICITING THESE INDUSTRIES, OIL AND GAS WAS NOT WHERE IT WAS TODAY.

NOW THAT YOU HAVE ANOTHER TYPE OF INDUSTRY THAT IS ACTIVE THAT ALSO HAS TO GO INTO THE GROUND, INTO THE EARTH, POTENTIALLY HOPEFULLY NOT OVER ANY KIND OF WASTE SITE OR IT COULD JUST DISTURB THOSE WASTE SITES, I THINK THERE IS A LOT MORE TO CONSIDER WHEN IT COMES TO THAT.

THESE ARE ALSO MASSIVE INDUSTRIES.

YOU MENTIONED THE NATION'S DUMPING GROUNDS.

WE ARE ALSO TALKING INTERNATIONAL WASTE THAT COULD GET TO NEW MEXICO, IF THIS GROUP WERE TO EXPAND.

I THINK ONE OF THE BIGGER ELEMENTS TOO, WE ARE GOING TO CONSIDER WITH THE TIMING OF THE DIFFERENT APPLICATIONS BEING FILED, EVEN IF THE FEDS APPROVE HOLTEC'S PLAN, HOLTEC WOULD STILL ALSO HAVE TO APPLY FOR STATE PERMITS WITH THE DEPARTMENT OF ENERGY AS WELL AS DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION.

UNDER THE NEW LAW, THE STATE DOES HAVE SOME STRICT GUIDELINES, NO.

1, NOT TO SOLICIT NEW PERMITS AND GRANTS FOR NUCLEAR STORAGE WASTE.

THAT IS IN DIRECT CONFLICT WITH THE STATE LAW, BUT THEN WHERE IT IS GOING TO BECOME A BIG THING IS THE BATTLE IN COURTS WHERE IT IS PREEMPTIVE ARGUMENTS MADE.

THE CONCEPT WHERE COUNTY LAWS, STATE LAWS ARE TRUMPED COUNTY LAW AND FEDERAL LAW TRUMPS STATE LAW.

WE COULD END UP -- THE HOLTEC NEGOTIATION COULD BE GOING ON FOR YEARS BEFORE ANYTHING IS ACTUALLY BUILT OR DUG INTO THE GROUND.

>> Gene: THAT IS A GOOD POINT.

>> Dede: THE HOPE IS IN THAT TIME PERIOD THERE WILL BE ANOTHER PERMANENT WASTE FACILITY DESIGNATED BY THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.

THAT IS THE PROBLEM HERE IS THAT THIS IS SUPPOSED TO BE AN INTERIM FACILITY AND YET INTERIM FACILITIES HAVE A WAY OF BECOMING PERMANENT, DON'T THEY?

>> Gene: THANK YOU.

>> Dede: THAT IS WHAT IS HAPPENING WITH WIPP.

>> Gene: GOING TO CHANGE UP A LITTLE BIT AND GO TO ANOTHER ENVIRONMENTAL ISSUE OUT THERE HEADING TO SANDOVAL COUNTY, FAR DIFFERENT ENVIRONMENTAL CONCERN UP THERE, AND THAT IS WATER.

GOVERNOR DECLARED A STATE OF EMERGENCY IN SANDOVAL COUNTY LAST WEEK, BECAUSE THE JEMEZ RIVER IS RUNNING CAUSING FLOODING IN THE JEMEZ RIVER VALLEY, ANDY.

RANCHERS, NEIGHBORHOODS, AN ANOMALY, CLIMATE CHANGE?

WHAT IS GOING ON HERE?

A LOT OF WHIPLASH BETWEEN DROUGHT AND FLOODING WE ARE SUFFERING HERE IN NEW MEXICO.

>> Andy: IT IS HARD NOT TO SEE THIS AS AN IMPACT OF CLIMATE CHANGE, RIGHT.

WHEN YOU SEE THAT THE SNOW PACK IS MELTING FASTER THAN WE WOULD WANT IT TO AND EVERYTHING IS RUSHING DOWN THE RIVER AND THEN WHEN THINGS FREEZE UP AGAIN, IT SLOWS DOWN, AND THERE WAS SOME GREAT QUOTES AND A LOT OF THE STORIES THAT HAVE COME OUT, OR NOT QUOTES, BUT, YOU KNOW, THAT SORT OF THAT WE ARE AT NATURE'S MERCY.

WE CAN'T REALLY CONTROL WHAT HAPPENS.

I GUESS WE HAVE IMPACTS ON IT BUT WE ARE JUST SORT OF AT ITS WILL.

>> Gene: YOU HAVE LOCAL KNOWLEDGE OF THE JEMEZ RIVER VALLEY, FOR SURE, PERSONALLY.

WHAT HAS THE FLOODING BEEN LIKE?

HAVE YOU BEEN UP TO SEE IT?

>> Dede: WE HAVE A WEEKEND PLACE UP IN JEMEZ SPRINGS WHICH IS THE EPICENTER OF THIS.

AND I GOT TO TELL YOU, I WAS DELIGHTED.

IT WAS WONDERFUL TO SEE THIS SURGE, THIS SPRING RUNOFF AND SEE THE BOSQUE FLOODED BANKS OF THE JEMEZ RIVER BEGINNING TO MEANDER RATHER THAN HAVING A STRAIGHT CHANNEL.

THIS WAS WHAT IT USED TO BE LIKE.

AND THE DANGER IS OVER.

I WENT AROUND AND LOOKED AT THE BEGINNING OF LAST WEEK, WHICH IS WHEN IT WAS AT ITS HEIGHT, I THINK, MAYBE SEVEN OR EIGHT FEET.

NINE FEET IS FLOODING.

AND JEMEZ SPRINGS HAD THAT IN 1942 WAS THE LAST TIME.

THE RIVER IS NOW AT ABOUT SIX FEET.

THAT IS REALLY NOT A PROBLEM EXCEPT FOR ONE THING AND THIS IS I THINK CHARACTERISTIC OF A LOT OF RURAL COMMUNITIES, AND THAT IS, THEY HAVE THEIR SMALL SEWAGE TREATMENT PLANT LOCATED RIGHT NEXT TO THE RIVER.

SO, THEY HAVE THAT BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF PEOPLE LIKE TO LIVE NEXT TO THE RIVER WHEN THEY ARE IN THESE RURAL COMMUNITIES AND IF THEY HAVE SEPTIC TANKS THEN THAT POLLUTES THE RIVER.

SO, THEREFORE, THE MUNICIPALITY WHEN THEY HAVE THE MONEY TO DO IT, BUILD THESE SMALL SEWAGE TREATMENT PLANTS.

AND IN THIS CASE, THE SEWAGE TREATMENT PLANT WAS FLOODED AND THE PUMPS FAILED.

SEWAGE DID GET INTO THE RIVER.

NOT ENOUGH TO REALLY POLLUTE THE RIVER.

E-COLI COUNT WAS ONE AND CONTAMINATION IS FOUR.

AND THEY HAVE BEEN PUMPING OUT AND SORT OF RESCUING THE SEWAGE TREATMENT PLANT.

THERE WAS ALSO A PIPE THAT FAILED.

AND THERE HAS BEEN EXCELLENT COORDINATION BETWEEN THE PUEBLO, WHICH IS DOWNSTREAM OF JEMEZ SPRINGS, AND THEY ARE DUMPING SOME OF THIS WASTE INTO A LAGOON AT JEMEZ PUEBLO.

IT IS BEING MANAGED EFFECTIVELY, I THINK, AND THE WEATHER IS GETTING A BIT CHILLIER.

LAST WEEK THERE WAS A BIG WARM SPELL AND THAT SENT A BIG SURGE OF RIVER WATER DOWN THERE, SO -- >> Gene: IT IS THE TALK OF THE WEST, CALIFORNIA TO HERE, AND EVERYBODY IS TALKING ABOUT A BLESSING IN DISGUISE AND NOW WE HAVE TO MANAGE THIS.

DOES THE AREA NEED FOR DAMS, FLOOD-BASED INFRASTRUCTURE?

HAVE WE LEARNED FROM THE FLOODING WE BACK IN THE OLD CERRO GRANDE THAT WIPED OUT DIXON APPLE FARMS AND THEY WERE PLACING BARRIERS.

DO WE NEED TO DO BETTER AT THAT AND COUNT ON FLOODING AT THIS POINT?

>> Shaun: I THINK WHAT THE SENATOR SAID ABOUT JEMEZ PUEBLO DOWNSTREAM HAVING THE CAPACITY TO MANAGE A LOT OF THE FLOODING IS BECAUSE OF THE INFRASTRUCTURE THAT THE PUEBLO NOW HAS.

THE PUEBLO HAS ENTERPRISES LIKE A DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION THAT THEY OPERATE.

THEY HAVE A HOUSING DEVELOPMENT.

THEY HAVE AN EARLY CHILDHOOD CENTER AND A NATURAL RESOURCES DEPARTMENT THAT ARE BUILT TO OPERATE AND MANAGE THE FLOODING AND IRRIGATION THAT THERE ARE STILL FARMERS USING THIS WATER WITHIN THE PUEBLO WHO HAVE MASSIVE SPACES OF LAND.

THAT'S WHERE YOU GET THAT GOOD JEMEZ PUEBLO CHILE.

SO, I THINK THAT SEEING THE CAPACITY FOR THE PUEBLO TO HAVE THAT MILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN INFRASTRUCTURE TO HELP SUSTAIN THE SORT OF STATE, COUNTY AND LOCAL TOWNSHIPS COLLABORATIVE, THAT IS HOW YOU STRENGTHEN IT.

BECAUSE FOR THE LONGEST TIME THERE WAS STATE, COUNTY AND THEN THE PUEBLO, WHICH WAS KIND OF ALWAYS TRYING TO KEEP UP AND DIDN'T HAVE THE SUBSTANTIAL RESOURCES THAT IT DOES NOW.

BUT, YEAH, I THINK THAT IS BENEFICIAL TO THE OVERALL EFFORT.

IT DOESN'T AFFECT PEOPLE EVEN FURTHER DOWN THE STREAM LIKE SAN YSIDRO FURTHER DOWN AND EVEN THE ROAD CONDITIONS SO PEOPLE CAN STILL ACCESS THEIR HOMES.

>> Gene: FLOODING IS AN ISSUE.

IT IS SO INTERESTING TO GO FROM DEAD DRY, DUST BLOWING AROUND, TO MORE WATER THAN WE CAN MANAGE, CALIFORNIA, LAKE MEAD IS COMING UP.

I DON'T KNOW WHERE ELEPHANT BUTTE IS, IF ANYBODY HAS HEARD IF WE ARE STARTING TO RISE OUR WATER LEVELS DOWN THERE.

FROM THE RUNOFF, ALL WE CAN DO IS HOPE AT THIS POINT.

SENATOR HAVE YOU HEARD?

>> Dede: I THINK THE RESERVOIRS IN NORTHERN NEW MEXICO ARE FILLING UP BUT THE AMOUNT THAT IS IN ELEPHANT BUTTE IS JUST DEPENDENT UPON THE RELEASES FROM THOSE RESERVOIRS.

>> Gene: IT IS GOING TO TAKE A LONG TIME FOR ELEPHANT BUTTE DOWNSTREAM.

THANKS AGAIN TO THE LINE PANEL FOR THIS WEEK.

BE SURE TO LET US KNOW WHAT YOU THINK ABOUT ANY TOPICS WE COVERED ON OUR SOCIAL MEDIA PAGES AND CHECK OUT AN EXTRA CONVERSATION I HAD WITH THIS GROUP ABOUT NEW SCHEDULES COMING TO ALBUQUERQUE PUBLIC SCHOOLS.

THAT'S ON THE NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS YOUTUBE PAGE.

BUT RIGHT NOW WE ARE LOOKING AHEAD TO THE PREMIER OF A NEW FILM PROFILING A POLARIZING FIGURE HERE IN NEW MEXICO HISTORY.

THAT WOULD BE ROBERT OPPENHEIMER.

NEW MEXICO FILMMAKER, LARRY SHEFFIELD'S, DOCUMENTARY PIECES TOGETHER OLD FOOTAGE, DECLASSIFIED FOOTAGE AND DOCUMENTS AND OTHER RESEARCH FROM MONTHS AND YEARS AFTER THE NUCLEAR TESTS AT WHITE SANDS MISSILE RANGE.

THIS WEEK ON THE NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS FACEBOOK PAGE I SPOKE WITH MR. SHEFFIELD ABOUT THE INSPIRATION BEHIND HIS FILM AND THE CONTINUED FASCINATION WITH OPPENHEIMER'S LEGACY.

YOU HAVE AN INTERESTING EVENT COMING UP REGARDING A VERY SPECIFIC TIME IN MR. OPPENHEIMER'S HISTORY AND IT IS AFTER TRINITY.

AND WE HAVE SPENT SO MUCH TIME IN OUR CULTURE, THROUGH HOLLYWOOD AND OTHER PLACES, TALKING ABOUT THE BEFORE AND RUNUP AND DURING, BUT NOT SO MUCH THE AFTER.

WHY DID YOU WANT TO CUT AT IT THIS WAY AND LOOK AT HIS LIFE AFTER TRINITY?

>> Sheffield: WHAT IS INTERESTING IS SO OUR FILM, FOR THE BENEFIT OF THE VIEWER, WE TALKED A LITTLE BIT ABOUT BEFORE, DURING AND AFTER TRINITY BUT THE BIGGEST PART OF THE FILM IS AFTER TRINITY AND ALL THE THINGS THAT HAPPENED AFTER.

AND MY FATHER WASN'T INVOLVED IN THE MILITARY BUT MY GRANDFATHER WAS, BROUGHT OUT TO NEW MEXICO TO WORK AT LOS ALAMOS IN THE MANHATTAN PROJECT, SO I DO HAVE A PERSONAL CONNECTION BUT, ANYWAY, I FELT LIKE I HAD A PERSPECTIVE THAT NEEDED TO BE TOLD.

AND I WANTED TO DO THREE DOCUMENTARY FILMS TO TELL THE WHOLE STORY OF EVERYTHING THAT WAS GOING ON IN NEW MEXICO AND SOUTHERN NEW MEXICO BETWEEN THAT PERIOD TIME.

AND WE JUST COULDN'T DO IT ALL IN ONE PROJECT.

IT IS ACTUALLY HARD TO TRY TO DO IT IN THREE DIFFERENT SEGMENTS BUT WE HAVE A TRILOGY THAT WE ARE PRODUCING.

WE HAVE DONE TWO OF THE THREE FILMS AND THE THIRD ONE IS ABOUT HALF FINISHED AND ALL THREE OF THESE WILL FOCUS ON JUST THAT MOMENT IN TIME AROUND THE MANHATTAN PROJECT AND THE EVENTS THAT HAPPENED THEREAFTER.

AND IN THE SECOND FILM, WHICH WE ARE SHOWING IN LOS ALAMOS THIS WEEKEND, WE REALLY FOCUS ON DR. OPPENHEIMER.

HE WAS ABSOLUTELY THE PIVOTAL PERSONALITY OF THIS WHOLE STORY AND IT WAS HIS ACTIONS AND REACTIONS THAT TOOK PLACE THAT WE REALLY TRIED TO FOCUS ON.

>> Gene: WHAT IS THE CONTINUING FASCINATION WITH THIS MAN?

I HAVE READ A LOT ABOUT HIM, WATCHED A LOT ABOUT HIM AND IT IS SO INTERESTING.

I DON'T KNOW IF WE HAVE EVER WRESTLED IT TO THE GROUND, WHO THIS MAN WAS.

DO YOU FEEL YOU HAVE?

>> Sheffield: HIS GRANDSON IS IN OUR FILM, BY THE WAY, AND WHEN I WAS DOWN INTERVIEWING HIM I SAID, YOU KNOW, I REALLY HAVE STUDIED YOUR GRANDFATHER AND REALLY TRIED TO GET INTO HIS HEAD AND READ JUST ABOUT EVERYTHING HE SAID DURING THIS PERIOD OF TIME AND I HAVE TRIED TO FIND EVERY AUDIO TAPE AND FILM TAPE THAT I CAN THAT IS ABOUT YOUR GRANDFATHER.

AND HE WAS A VERY COMPLEX, YET SIMPLE MAN.

HE WAS VERY COMFORTABLE IN NEW MEXICO BECAUSE HE LIKED THE SIMPLICITY OF LIVING OUT AND HORSEBACK RIDING, HIKING.

HE LOVED OUR FOOD.

AND HE LOVED OUR PEOPLE AND THE PEOPLE LOVED HIM.

HE WAS A VERY -- HE WAS THE KIND OF PERSON THAT HE DIDN'T CARE IF YOU WERE A SCIENTIST OR THE PERSON WORKING ON HIS CAR.

HE WOULD BEFRIEND YOU AND BE FRIENDLY AND GET TO KNOW YOU AND SO HE WAS A REALLY INTERESTING GUY, HAD A LOT OF CHARISMA.

AND YOU HEAR THE STORIES ABOUT THE SCIENTISTS THROUGH ALL THE TRIALS AND TRIBULATIONS IT WAS OPPENHEIMER'S LEADERSHIP AND CHARISMA THAT GOT THEM OFF TO THE NEXT BEAT.

SO, REALLY INTERESTING GUY.

SPOKE FRENCH, SPOKE ENGLISH.

I AM SURE HE SPOKE A LITTLE BIT OF SPANISH AND SO HE WAS JUST A REALLY INTERESTING PERSON.

>> Gene: DID HE DOCUMENT A LOT OF HIS THOUGHTS IN LIFE IN WRITING?

WAS HE ONE TO SCRIBE THINGS IN A JOURNAL?

DO WE HAVE A TRAIL THAT WAY TO HIS INNER THOUGHTS?

>> Sheffield: I DON'T THINK HE KEPT A DAILY JOURNAL.

WHAT HE DID MORE OF WAS SPEAK AND HE SPOKE DURING THE EVENT IN LOS ALAMOS BUT HE SPOKE EVEN MORE AFTER THE EVENT IN LOS ALAMOS.

SO OUR FILM COVERS A LOT OF HIS SPEECHES AND HAVING TO GO THROUGH THOSE SPEECHES SO I COULD FIND THE LITTLE BITS THAT ARE IN ALL THAT MATERIAL.

WE HAVE SOME REALLY INTERESTING THINGS THAT HE SAYS THAT ARE VERY DEEP AND PERSONAL, CONVICTIONS THAT HE HAD.

AND SO IT IS THOSE SPEECHES THAT REALLY TELL THE STORY.

BUT I HAVE NEVER FOUND A JOURNAL OR, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF -- THERE IS A LOT OF THINGS THAT HE WROTE BUT NOT ON A DAY-TO-DAY BASIS.

>> Gene: WE ARE TALKING TO LARRY SHEFFIELD.

HE IS THE DIRECTOR OF OPPENHEIMER AFTER TRINITY WHICH WILL DEBUT ON APRIL 22, THAT IS SATURDAY AT SALA EVENT AT THE LOS ALAMOS EVENT CENTER.

WE'LL TALK ABOUT THAT AT THE END OF THE INTERVIEW.

AS LARRY MENTIONED UP TOP, THAT IS SOLD OUT BUT THERE ARE OTHER SCREENINGS COMING UP.

HOW IS IT HE IS SO POLARIZING STILL TODAY?

1945 WAS A LONG TIME AGO.

LARRY, WHAT IS IT ABOUT -- IS IT HIM?

WE HAVE A CHRISTOPHER NOLAN DRAMATIZATION COMING UP THIS SUMMER.

WE HAD THAT MANHATTAN TELEVISION SERIES FOR A COUPLE OF YEARS OUT OF WGN IN CHICAGO A FEW YEARS AGO.

EVERYBODY WANTS TO KEEP TAKING THEIR CUT AT DR. OPPENHEIMER.

IT IS SO FASCINATING.

WHAT IS GOING ON HERE ALL THESE YEARS LATER?

>> Sheffield: DR. OPPENHEIMER, IT'S AN AMERICAN STORY.

IT IS A STORY ABOUT WHERE HE IS MINDING HIS OWN BUSINESS, TEACHING IN BERKELEY AND HE GETS APPROACHED ABOUT THIS THING THAT IS OF A NATIONAL CONCERN.

HE WANTS TO DO HIS PATRIOTIC DUTY ALONG WITH OTHERS, EVEN THOUGH THEY ARE MAYBE NOT AS FOCUSED ON THE POLITICS OF IT, THEY REALIZE THE URGENCY OF US NOT HAVING A MAD MAN TAKE US OVER BECAUSE HE GETS THIS TECHNOLOGY FIRST.

SO, HE PUTS ALL OF HIS RESOURCES NIGHT AND DAY AND HIS BLOOD SWEAT AND TEARS AND IS SUCCESSFUL.

AND EVEN IN, YOU KNOW, IT IS THE AMERICAN STORY ABOUT THE POWER AND THE GREED, IN SOME WAYS, YOU KNOW, WANTS TO DESTROY THE VERY THING THAT HE CREATED.

THE WHOLE TIME HE IS TRYING TO WARN EVERYONE, THE POLITICIANS, THE PEOPLE, THIS IS WHAT WE HAVE CREATED THAT NEEDS TO BE HANDLED AS GENTLY AND CAREFULLY AND METHODICAL AND IT IS ALMOST AS IF, YOU KNOW, HE WASN'T LISTENED TO.

SO THERE IS A LOT OF AMERICAN STORY ATTRIBUTES, A LOT OF HUMAN STORY ATTRIBUTES THAT ARE IN THIS ONE PERSONALITY OF THIS MAN.

AND, AS I MENTIONED EARLIER, HE IS AS SOPHISTICATED AS THE MOST -- HE CAN SIT DOWN AND SHOP TALK WITH EINSTEIN BUT AT THE SAME TIME I FOUND SO MANY STORIES WHERE HE BEFRIENDED PEOPLE -- HIS MECHANIC -- HIS FAVORITE PLACE WHERE HE ATE, HE GOT VERY CLOSE TO THE FOLKS THAT OWNED THAT PARTICULAR CAFE NEAR LOS ALAMOS.

SO, HE WAS THE KIND OF GUY THAT, YOU KNOW, ONCE AGAIN, HE BEFRIENDED EVERYBODY.

>> Gene: THAT IS KIND OF INTERESTING, A LITTLE INSIGHT INTO THE MAN THERE.

BECAUSE IT IS EASY TO THINK OF HIM AS A STAND-ALONE CHARACTER LIVING IN A BUBBLE, HUNG UP ON -- THE EVERYDAY LIFE OF MR. OPPENHEIMER IS NOT SOMETHING WE THINK ABOUT GENERALLY.

DID YOU LEARN SOMETHING NEW IN YOUR RESEARCH AND IN YOUR GOAL TO GET THIS FILM DONE?

WAS THERE SOMETHING ABOUT DR. OPPENHEIMER THAT SURPRISED YOU, YOU HADN'T REALIZED PREVIOUSLY?

>> Sheffield: I THINK THE TRAGEDY OF THE STORY.

I WENT INTO THIS WITH A WHOLE LOT OF DIFFERENT IDEAS AND THOUGHTS ON HOW TO PRESENT IT.

BUT THE THING THAT KEPT COMING BACK TO ME WAS THE TRAGEDY OF WHAT WAS DONE, TAKING AWAY HIS SECURITY CLEARANCE AND THE FACT THAT HE LIVED HIS ENTIRE LIFE TO THE VERY END TRYING TO PERSUADE HIS PEERS AND THE PEOPLE AT THE TIME ABOUT THIS NOVEL POWER.

AND I DON'T THINK HE WAS EVER ASHAMED OF DOING THE JOB BUT HE CERTAINLY WANTED US, THE WORLD, TO WORK TOGETHER IN HARMONY AND TRY TO CONTROL THIS GENIE OUT OF THE BOTTLE AS YOU WOULD CALL IT.

>> Gene: THAT BRINGS US TO THE SCREENING AND THE FOLKS THAT YOU ARE WORKING WITH IN LOS ALAMOS.

THEY ARE TICKLED OBVIOUSLY TO BE INVOLVED WITH YOU.

TELL US, FOR FOLKS THAT DON'T KNOW WHAT SALA IS AND THE ORGANIZATION, TELL US ABOUT THAT A LITTLE BIT, IF YOU WOULD, AND THEN WE'LL TALK ABOUT HOW FOLKS CAN SEE THE FILM.

>> Sheffield: SO, LOS ALAMOS HAS ONE THEATER AND IT CLOSED.

IT WAS A COMMERCIAL THEATER BUT IT KIND OF SHUT DOWN AND A VERY INNOVATIVE GENTLEMAN BOUGHT IT THAT STILL WANTS TO SHOW FILMS AND HAVE A KIND OF COMMUNITY CENTER WHERE PEOPLE CAN COME AND HAVE DIFFERENT EVENTS AND DIFFERENT COMMUNITY THINGS.

SO, WHEN I WAS SHOWING THE VERY FIRST FILM THAT WE HAD DONE, ALAMOGORDO CENTER OF THE WORLD, TRINITY 1945, WE HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO SHOW THAT FILM IN THE LODGE ON THE VERY DAY OF THE TRINITY TEST, JULY 16.

AND IT WAS REALLY AN HONOR FOR ME TO BE THERE BUT I MET ALLEN AND HE SAID, YOU KNOW, I HAVE A THEATER THAT IS AVAILABLE AND MAYBE ON YOUR NEXT FILM IF YOU WANT TO SHOW IT, WE CAN DO THAT.

WE DECIDED -- DR. OPPENHEIMER'S BIRTHDAY WOULD BE A GREAT TIME TO DO THAT AND I PROMISED THE PEOPLE OF LOS ALAMOS THAT THIS IS THEIR FILM, IT BELONGS TO THEM, THERE IS A LOT OF FOOTAGE THAT SO MANY OF THEM ARE GOING TO SEE THEY HAVE NEVER SEEN BEFORE.

I SAID, YOU KNOW, I WANT TO SHOW IT IN YOUR COMMUNITY FIRST.

I WANT YOU GUYS TO BE THE FIRST ONES TO HAVE THE ADVANTAGE OF SEEING THIS.

>> Gene: IT IS INTERNATIONAL DARK SKY WEEK, A TIME TO LOOK UP AND THINK ABOUT WHAT WE CAN SEE, NOT WITH HIGH-POWERED TELESCOPES OR NASA TECHNOLOGY, BUT WHAT WE CAN SEE WITH OUR OWN EYES.

LIGHT POLLUTION HAS BLOCKED THE NIGHT SKIES IN SO MANY PLACES WORLDWIDE BUT THIS WEEK AS OUR LAND SENIOR PRODUCER, LAURA PASKUS, REPORTS, EVERYONE IS ENCOURAGED TO TURN OUT THE LIGHTS SO WE CAN ALL SEE THE NATURAL BEACON SHINING DOWN FROM ABOVE UP.

>> Laura: FOR MILLIONS OF YEARS THROUGHOUT OUR EVOLUTION AS A SPECIES, WE HAVE LOOKED TO THE SAME NIGHT SKY.

WE HAVE TOLD STORIES, NAVIGATED, WONDERED WHAT LIES BEYOND OUR OWN BEAUTIFUL EARTH.

THAT SKY BELONGS TO ALL OF US, NOT JUST A FEW.

>> Ricks: SPACE IS SO BIG THAT A LOT OF PEOPLE SAY THAT IT MAKES THEM FEEL INSIGNIFICANT.

WE ARE VERY TINY IN THE GRAND SCHEME OF THINGS BUT BEING ABLE TO LOOK OUT AND SEE SOME OF THESE THINGS THAT ARE SO FAR AWAY, SO BIG, THE SCALE OF THIS IS SO UNIMAGINABLE, AND YET WE ARE ABLE TO TAKE PART IN THAT.

WE ARE PART OF THAT AND SO IN ONE SENSE YOU FEEL SMALL AND IN ANOTHER SENSE YOU FEEL BIG.

IT IS KIND OF MAGIC.

>> Laura: TODAY WE CELEBRATE DARK PLACES.

WE CALL THEM DARK SKY PARKS AND THE NATIONAL PARK SERVICE HOLDS STAR PARTIES TREATING THE NIGHT SKY WITH THE SAME REFERENCE AS DEEP CANYONS OR REMOTE MOUNTAIN TOPS.

WE CAN LOOK AT THE RING NEBULA, AND THE RING NEBULA IS EXACTLY WHAT IT SOUNDS LIKE.

IT IS A RING FLOATING IN THE SKY.

IT IS ALMOST A PERFECT RING AND WHAT IT IS, IT IS A DIEING STAR.

>> Poskus: THE DAY THAT I DISCOVERED THE THINGS THAT I CAN SEE THROUGH AN AMATEUR TELESCOPE IS A DAY THAT I'LL REMEMBER UNTIL THE DAY I DIE.

I SAW OBJECTS THAT LOOKED LIKE DIAMONDS SCATTERED ON VELVET.

I SAW CLOUDS AND I SAW GALAXIES.

I SAW GALAXIES THREE OR 400 MILLION LIGHT YEARS AWAY.

AND THE IDEA OF THEN SHOWING THAT TO SOMEBODY AND SAYING, THE LIGHT FROM THIS GALAXY LEFT THAT GALAXY LONG BEFORE DINOSAURS EVEN WALKED THE EARTH, AND SEEING THEIR FACES JUST GO WHOA, THAT IS AS COOL AS IT GETS.

YOU CAN'T BEAT THAT.

>> Laura: ISABELLE AND RICK FROM BROWNSVILLE, TEXAS STOPPED AT THE CAPULIN STAR PARTY WHILE ON VACATION.

>> WE ARE ALL STARDUST.

WE ARE ALL PART OF THE UNIVERSE, YOU KNOW.

SO IT IS JUST, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING THAT YOU GAZE UPON ON A STEADY BASIS IF YOU'RE OUT AND YOU WONDER, YOU KNOW.

>> IT IS JUST BEAUTIFUL AT NIGHT.

>> Laura: OVER THE PAST CENTURY WE HAVE STEADILY CHANGED OUR RELATIONSHIP WITH THE SKY.

IN HIS NOVEL "CONTACT" KARL SAGAN WROTE ABOUT COSMIC ISOLATIONISM, ON HOW, WITHOUT EVEN NOTICING, MOST PEOPLE CUT THEMSELVES OFF FROM THE SKY.

WE LEARNED MORE ABOUT WHAT LIES BEYOND OUR OWN WORLD.

WE HAVE LOOKED DEEPER INTO SPACE, BUT OUR OWN SKY VIEW, WE LIT IT UP, CONCEALED SO MUCH OF WHAT WE USED TO SEE.

>> Finn: ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE LOSE IN TERMS OF OUR CHILDREN PARTICULARLY IS WE ARE LIMITING THE SCOPE OF THEIR IMAGINATION AND THEIR CURIOSITY.

AND THAT HAS, OF COURSE, TREMENDOUS REPERCUSSIONS FOR THE FUTURE.

WE LOSE THE APPRECIATION THAT WE PERSONALLY GET FROM LOOKING AT THE SKY.

IF THE SKY IS NOTHING BUT A GLOW ABOVE YOU FROM THE STREET LIGHTS, THEN, THERE IS NOTHING TO SEE.

AND THERE IS NOTHING TO APPRECIATE.

>> Laura: FINN SAYS THERE ARE SIMPLE WAYS TO FIGHT LIGHT POLLUTION.

TURN OFF OUTSIDE LIGHTS, LIGHT CITIES MORE RESPONSIBLY, EVEN CLOSE YOUR CURTAINS AT NIGHT.

>> Finn: ONE OF THE NICE THINGS ABOUT LIGHT POLLUTION IS THAT IT DOESN'T DESTROY THE NIGHT.

IT JUST HIDES IT.

SO, YOU CAN GET THE NIGHT BACK LIKE THAT, IF YOU JUST TURN OFF THE LIGHTS.

THERE ARE NOT A LOT OF ENVIRONMENTAL THINGS WHERE THE SOLUTION IS SO EASY.

>> Laura: CARL SAGAN WROTE ABOUT HOW AT THE VERY MOMENT THAT HUMANS DISCOVERED THE SCALE OF THE UNIVERSE AND FOUND THAT OUR MOST UNCONSTRAINED FANCIES WERE, IN FACT, DWARFED BY THE TRUE DIMENSIONS OF EVEN THE MILKY WAY GALAXY, WE TOOK STEPS THAT ENSURED THAT OUR DESCENDANTS WOULD BE UNABLE TO SEE THE STARS AT ALL BUT WE CAN CHANGE THAT.

WE CAN PROTECT THE SKIES ALL OF OUR ANCESTORS WATCHED.

WE CAN TURN OUT THE LIGHTS AND LOOK UP AND WONDER TOGETHER.

FOR NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS, AND OUR LAND, I AM LAURA PASKUS.

>> Gene: IN CASE YOU MISSED THE COVERAGE, THE ALBUQUERQUE CITY COUNCIL ON MONDAY APPROVED A 200 MILLION DOLLAR INFRASTRUCTURE PLAN.

THERE WAS SOME PRETTY GOOD DEBATE, AS YOU MIGHT IMAGINE, CONSIDERING HOW MANY THINGS HAVE NOT SEEN AN UPGRADE.

NOW HOUSING, ROADS, LIGHTING, IT WAS ALL IN THERE READY FOR YOUR APPROVAL FOR A BOND VOTE THIS FALL, BUT IT WAS ONE ITEM APPROVED THAT NEEDS ILLUMINATING AND EXPLANATION.

YOUR CITY COUNCIL HAS APPROVED FOUR MILLION DOLLARS TO MOVE A MUSEUM.

THAT IS RIGHT.

THE UNSER RACING MUSEUM, CURRENTLY SITTING IN LOS RANCHOS AND DRAWING LESS THAN 20,000 VISITORS A YEAR IN NO SMALL PART BECAUSE OF ITS ABSURD LOCATION, WHICH BRINGS ME TO THE HISTORICAL RUB HERE.

NOW, BACK IN 2005 WHEN THE LOCATIONS FOR THE UNSER RACING MUSEUM WERE ANNOUNCED, THEN MAYOR MARTIN CHAVEZ LOST HIS MIND, AND WITH GOOD REASON.

THE UNSERS REPRESENT NINE INDY 500 WINS, PIKES PEAK VICTORIES, YOU NAME IT, THEY HAVE WON IT.

IF YOU'RE NEW HERE THE UNSER NAME BACK THEN WAS ALBUQUERQUE AND MAYOR CHAVEZ KNEW THAT MUSEUM NEEDED TO BE IN THE CITY PROPER FOR OBVIOUS REASONS.

NOW, HE EVEN HAD A BUILDING NEAR OLD TOWN EARMARKED FOR IT, RIGHT SOUTH OF I-40, BUT SOME MEMBERS OF THE UNSER FAMILY DIDN'T WANT TO HEAR ABOUT IT.

IT GOT UGLY BETWEEN THEM AND THE MAYOR AND IN THE SCRUM, A MAJOR TOURIST DRAW WAS LEFT TO ROT ON A BARELY ACCESSIBLE LOCATION.

NOW, YOU GET TO PAY FOUR MILLION DOLLARS PLUS TO DO WHAT SHOULD HAVE HAPPENED IN 2005.

HERE IS A QUESTION.

IS THE UNSER FAMILY GOING TO KICK IN FINANCIALLY TO MAKE UP FOR THEIR DECISION?

DON'T FORGET, THE UNSERS IN THE PAST FLOATED THE IDEA OF MOVING THE WHOLE THING TO INDIANAPOLIS WHICH MAKES SOME SENSE, BUT NOW NEBRASKA IS THE THREAT.

BUT, IS CENTRAL AND UNSER, THE NEW PROPOSED LOCATION, TRULY ANY BETTER FOR THE CITY THAN MONTANO.

COUNCILOR PENA CALLS CENTRAL AND UNSER, QUOTE, THE HEART OF THE CITY.

I WOULD DEBATE THAT.

NOW I AM A RACE CAR GUY AND THE UNSER NAME MEANS SOMETHING TO ME PERSONALLY, BUT IN THIS SEASON OF THE MUSEUM FOLLIES WE ARE CURRENTLY SUFFERING, THIS IDEA NEEDS A YELLOW FLAG.

PERHAPS EVEN RED.

THANKS AGAIN FOR JOINING US AND FOR STAYING INFORMED AND ENGAGED.

SEE YOU AGAIN NEXT WEEK, IN FOCUS.

FUNDING FOR NEW MEXICO IN FOCUS PROVIDED BY VIEWERS LIKE YOU.