♪ MUSIC REPORT FROM SANTA FE IS MADE POSSIBLE, IN PART, BY GRANTS FROM THE NEW MEXICO MUNICIPAL LEAGUE, A BETTER NEW MEXICO THROUGH BETTER CITIES AND FROM THE HEALY FOUNDATION, TAOS, NM.

HELLO, I'M LORENE MILLS, AND WELCOME TO REPORT FROM SANTA F. OUR GUEST TODAY IS SENATOR GEORGE MUNOZ, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR JOINING US.

>>GEORGE: THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

>>LORENE: YOU'RE FROM GALLUP AND YOU REPRESENT DISTRICT FOUR, WHAT THREE COUNTIES?

>>GEORGE: THREE COUNTIES.

>>LORENE: AND YOU'VE BEEN A SENATOR SINCE 2009, YOUR DAD WAS A MAYOR OF GALLUP, YOU LIVE IN GALLUP.

YOU ARE CHAIR OF THE SENATE FINANCE COMMITTEE AND IN THE INTERIM, YOU'RE CHAIR OF THE LEGISLATIVE FINANCE COMMITTEE, THANK YOU FOR ALL YOU DO.

I'M WONDERING BECAUSE THERE IS A DISCONNECT BETWEEN PEOPLE THINKING WE HAVE ALL THIS MONEY AND YET YOU HAVE CERTAIN LIMITATIONS.

THE BUDGET HAS TO BE BALANCED, WE CAN ONLY HAVE A CERTAIN PERCENT INCREASE, SO HOW DO YOU DEAL WITH THE PRESSURES BECAUSE PEOPLE ARE NOT EDUCATED AND THEY DON'T KNOW WE'VE GOT MONEY, LET'S BUILD HOT DOG STANDS ON EVERY CORNER, WHATEVER.

SO HOW DO YOU DEAL WITH THAT KIND OF PRESSURE, PEOPLE ALWAYS COME TO YOU AND SAY, I'VE GOT THIS GREAT IDEA WE'VE GOT ALL THIS MONEY.

>>LORENE: WELL, I THINK WE NEED TO LEAD NEW MEXICO IN THIS MENTALITY.

WE'RE NOT A POOR STATE ANYMORE, WE HAVE OIL AND GAS REVENUES.

WE'RE PUTTING OURSELVES UNDER THE DIRECTORY OF INVESTING.

BY 2040, OUR INVESTMENT INCOME WILL EQUAL OUR OIL AND GAS INCOME.

>>LORENE: THAT'S BRILLIANT.

>>GEORGE: THAT'S A BOLD MOVE IN A TWO YEAR SITUATION AS CHAIR OF LFC, AS CHAIR OF SENATE FINANCE AND SO YOU HAVE TO BALANCE WHAT ARE PRIORITIES IN THE STATE, RIGHT.

MY MOTHER TOLD ME ONCE, RIGHT, YOU'VE GOT TO REMEMBER THE POOR PEOPLE IN THIS STATE AND YOU'VE GOT TO REMEMBER EEVERYBODY THEY'RE ALL COUNTING ON YOU.

THAT'S A LOT OF WEIGHT ON YOUR SHOULDERS.

SO HOW DO YOU HANDLE THAT?

YOU'VE GOT TO MAKE THE BEST DECISIONS AND WE RELY ON OUR STAFF, WE RELY ON OTHER SENATORS AND LEGISLATORS TO HELP US MAKE THE BEST DECISION WHAT'S BEST FOR NEW MEXICO.

IT'S A BROAD SPECTRUM OF NEEDS ACROSS THE STATE, EAST TO WEST, NORTH TO SOUTH, IT'S A DIFFERENT SITUATION.

YOU'VE GOT TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO MANAGE THAT, THAT'S A LITTLE TRICKY AT TIMES.

>>LORENE: ABSOLUTELY, ABSOLUTELY.

AND ALSO AGAIN, BECAUSE PEOPLE DON'T EDUCATE THEMSELVES ON WHAT YOUR STRUCTURE IS, WHAT YOUR LIMITATIONS ARE.

AS A MATTER OF FACT, ONE OF THE HEADLINES WAS SENATE FINANCE CHAIRMAN PUSHES BACK ON-AIR QUALITY PERMIT DELAYS IN THEIR MID-YEAR REQUEST TO BOOST THEIR BUDGET 31%.

SO WHAT WAS WRONG WITH THAT SCENARIO?

>>GEORGE: WELL, THE ENVIRONMENT DEPARTMENT OVER THE LAST FOUR YEARS GOT ALMOST 100% BUDGET INCREASE.

WE HAD SOME PROBLEMS WITH THEIR PAY SITUATION, BUT I MEAN THIS IS A REPEAT DEAL THAT THE SECRETARY DOES TO US EVERY SINGLE YEAR COMING IN.

I DIDN'T GET THIS AND IF I DON'T GET THIS NOW, I'M NOT GOING TO DO THAT.

THAT'S NOT THE WAY IT WORKS.

THIS IS A STATE GOVERNMENT, WE STILL HAVE TO OPERATE, PEOPLE STILL NEED THEIR EQUALITY PERMITS, WHETHER IT'S FOR A CONCRETE PLAN OR AN ASPHALT PLAN TO BUILD A SCHOOL IN CERTAIN AREAS, IT'S NOT JUST OIL AND GAS.

SO THINK ABOUT THE BIGGER PICTURE, THINK ABOUT HOW THAT AFFECTS EVERYTHING AROUND NEW MEXICO, RIGHT?

HOW WE'RE GOING TO MANAGE AND SO, YOU KNOW, ON ALL THE GRAND SCHEME OF THINGS, YOU WANT TO PUBLICIZE OR POLITICIZE THIS THING.

WELL, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE PLENTY OF MONEY, YOU'RE OWN BOARD TURNS YOU DOWN FOR REASONS THAT THEY SAID THEY WEREN'T JUSTIFIED, SO WHEN THEY DO THAT AND THEN YOU TRY TO COME TO ANOTHER ONE AND THEY JUST FINED AN OIL AND GAS COMPANY $40 MILLION.

WHERE'S THAT MONEY GOING, HOW DOES THAT WORK, BUT DON'T TELL US YOU'RE GOING TO SHUT DOWN GOVERNMENT BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T GET SOMETHING AFTER A FOUR YEAR, 100% BUDGET INCREASE.

LET'S WORK TOGETHER, NOT AGAINST EACH OTHER.

>>LORENE: YEAH, I HOPE THEY WERE RESPONSIVE.

>>GEORGE: WE OPENED THE DOOR AND SHINED A LIGHT ON IT FOR THEM, WE'LL SEE.

>>LORENE: SO, ONE OF YOUR PREDECESSORS, ALL OF THE HEAD OF SENATE FINANCE HAS BEEN REALLY POWERFUL, POWERFUL PEOPLE, BUT ONE IN PARTICULAR THAT I WAS VERY FOND OF WAS SENATOR JOHN ARTHUR SMITH FROM DEMING.

HE WAS CALLED DOCTOR NO AND THE REASON IS THAT PEOPLE WOULD COME LIKE, OH WE HAVE ALL THIS MONEY, WE HAVE TO DO ALL THIS.

HE WAS A FISCAL CONSERVATIVE, HE BELIEVED IN THE PRUDENT MAN POLICY, ALSO THE PEOPLE WHO WANT THIS MONEY, THEY WANT IT RECURRING AND THE WHOLE OIL AND GAS SITUATION IS NOT ALWAYS PREDICTABLE.

IT'S A LITTLE BIT VOLATILE.

AND YOU CAN'T LEAVE A STRUCTURE INFRASTRUCTURE OF SPENDING STRUCTURE WHEN YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO DEAL WITH THIS YEAR AND IS IT GOING TO BE RECURRING OR IS IT A ONE-TIME THING.

SO HOW DO YOU, I JUST THINK IKE SMALLEY, WHO WAS ANOTHER WONDERFUL HEAD OF SENATE FINANCE, BUT HE SAID, YOU'VE GOT TO BE ABLE TO TELL PEOPLE TO GO TO HELL POLITELY, NICELY.

SO, DO THEY HEAR YOU, HAVE YOU PERFECTED THAT?

>>GEORGE: I DON'T KNOW IF I PERFECTED THAT SKILL, BUT THEY LIVED IN A DIFFERENT TIME, THEY LIVED IN A TIME WHEN WE ROLL BOOM AND BUST.

WE'RE NOT SEEING THAT IN OUR FUTURE FORECASTING, WE'RE SEEING IT COME UP INCREDIBLY AND LEVEL OFF AND THEN WE'RE GOING TO STAY LEVEL FOR A COUPLE OF YEARS AND THEN IT'S A SLOW DECLINE.

SO SENATOR SMITH AND IKE SMALLEY LIVED IN A TIME WHERE WE DIDN'T KNOW WHAT THE NEXT CRISIS WAS GOING TO BE.

I MEAN, WHEN I CAME IN 2009, WE CUT A BILLION OUT OF THE BUDGET.

>>LORENE: YOU CUT A BILLION OUT OF THE BUDGET?

>>GEORGE: IN 2009 AND 2010, YES.

SO AS A FRESHMAN, YOU LEARN VERY QUICKLY HOW IMPORTANT CAPITAL OUTLAY IS.

FOR THREE YEARS WE DIDN'T EVEN KNOW WHAT CAPITAL OUTLAY WAS, RIGHT, BECAUSE THERE WAS NO MONEY TO DO THAT.

>>LORENE: RIGHT, RIGHT, THAT'S TRUE.

>>GEORGE: SENATOR SMITH WAS IN THE SAME WAY, ALWAYS GOT TO BE CAUTIOUS OF THE OIL ROLLER COASTER THAT WE'RE RIDING, I GOT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE WERE PROTECTED BECAUSE WE WENT TO A LOT OF SPECIAL SESSIONS, PROBABLY MY FIRST FIVE YEARS, THEN THROUGH THE END OF HIS TERM IN 2018, 2019.

IN 2016, WE RODE ANOTHER ROLLER COASTER, SO IT WAS A DIFFERENT TIME, AND IT WAS A DIFFERENT AMOUNT OF MONEY.

>>LORENE: WELL, CAN YOU TELL US A LITTLE MORE ABOUT THE PEAKS AND VALLEYS AND HOW WE CAN ANTICIPATE THIS ROLLER COASTER WHERE WE'RE GOING NEXT?

>>GEORGE: WELL, DURING SENATOR SMITH'S TERM, THERE WAS A LOT OF THEM, RIGHT, I JUST MENTIONED WE WENT THROUGH CUTS AND HOW WE NAVIGATED THAT.

I LEARNED A LOT, THIS IS A LEARNING PROCESS, THERE'S NOT A DAY I DON'T COME IN THIS BUILDING THAT I DON'T LEARN SOMETHING THAT I DIDN'T KNOW.

THAT COMES WITH AGE AND TIME.

>>LORENE: YEAH, YEAH, YEAH, YEAH.

BUT IT'S A TRUE, YOU KNOW, NOT BUSY BEING BORN IS BUSY DYING.

YOU ARE ALWAYS LEARNING AND THE SITUATION WE'RE BUILDING ON SHIFTING SAND.

>>GEORGE: úAND OPPORTUNITY'S KNOCKING, RIGHT, THEY KNOCKED ON OUR DOOR IN 2020 AND SAID, WE'RE GOING TO GIVE YOU SOMETHING THAT YOU'VE NEVER HAD BEFORE AND HOW DO WE DO THAT BEST FOR NEW MEXICO.

THAT'S THE THING THAT WE NEED TO DO.

AND IT'S NOT HOW YOU LEARN TO SAY NO NOW, IT'S HOW YOU LEARN TO SAY WHAT'S BEST AND HOW DO WE MAXIMIZE THAT INVESTMENT.

HOW DO WE TRACK THAT INVESTMENT, SO WE KNOW THAT WE'RE GETTING A RETURN FOR OUR TAXPAYER DOLLARS.

AND HOW DO WE MAKE NEW MEXICO BETTER, THAT'S THE GOAL.

>>LORENE: AND ACTUALLY THAT'S EVERYONE'S GOAL AND SO YOU TAKE IT AWAY FROM THE PERSONAL NO, YOU CAN'T HAVE ALL THIS MONEY FOR YOUR PET PROJECT, TO LET'S LOOK AT THE BIG PICTURE OF WHAT IS THE BEST FOR NEW MEXICO.

AND THEN ALL THAT BLAME AND GIMME, GIMME ALL OF THAT GOES AWAY, BECAUSE YOU, IN YOUR POSITION, ALWAYS WORK FOR WHAT'S BEST FOR NEW MEXICO.

>>GEORGE: I MEAN THAT'S OUR GOAL, EVERY SINGLE DAY.

I HAVE A FAMILY, THEY'RE GOING TO START BUILDING A FAMILY, OTHER PEOPLE HAVE FAMILIES AND HOW DO WE KEEP THEM HERE AND HOW DO WE EDUCATE THEM THE BEST WE CAN?

HOW DO WE GET THEM THE RESOURCES THEY NEED, WHAT'S THE MOST NEED IN NEW MEXICO?

SO, YOU KNOW, TO GO FROM DOCTOR NO TO DOCTOR I'M RICH, IS A HARD STORY AND IT'S A HARD DEAL TO NAVIGATE.

YOU CAN CALL ME A FISCAL CONSERVATIVE.

THE CONSTITUTION REQUIRES US TO HAVE A BALANCED BUDGET.

YOU KNOW, SENATOR SMITH, GOD REST HIS SOUL, TAUGHT ME A LOT, BUT NOW IT'S A DIFFERENT CHAPTER, IT'S A COMPLETELY DIFFERENT CHAPTER IN NEW MEXICO.

WHAT WE'VE DONE IS SAID, WE'RE GOING TO TAKE PART OF THIS MONEY AND WE'RE GOING TO SPEND IT AND CREATE GIGANTIC FUNDS THAT WE'VE NEVER SEEN BEFORE.

WE THINK OUR FUNDS ARE GOING TO TOP $100 BILLION IN THE NEXT 5 TO 10 YEARS.

>>LORENE: SO WHERE DO WE STAND IN THE WORLD IN TERMS OF PRIVATELY HELD INDEPENDENT MONEY FUNDS, OUR PERMANENT FUND, WHERE DO WE STAND?

>>GEORGE: WELL, BASED ON POPULATION, WE'RE NUMBER ONE, RIGHT?

WE CAN SAY THAT, I MEAN BASED ON POPULATION.

BUT IN OTHER GRAND SCHEME OF POPULATIONS, WE MAY RANK DIFFERENTLY, WE'RE GOING TO BE IN THE TOP FIVE OVERALL IN FUNDS IN A FOUR-YEAR PERIOD.

AND THAT'S THE SIC INVESTING CORRECTLY, US PUTTING MONEY CORRECTLY, US MAKING THE CORRECT TRANSFERS.

THE MOST IMPORTANT THING PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW IS WE'VE SET OURSELVES UP NOT TO RIDE THAT OIL AND GAS ROLLER COASTER, THAT'S THE MOST IMPORTANT THING.

THAT'S WHAT SENATOR SMITH MADE HIM DOCTOR NO AND HOW DO YOU TAKE THAT AWAY FROM WHOEVER'S IN THE SEAT NEXT?

AND I MEAN THAT THAT TELLS US THAT NEW MEXICO IS MAKING GREAT STRIDES AND EVERY NEW MEXICAN SHOULD SAY, HOLD YOUR HEAD UP HIGH.

WE'RE NOT A POOR STATE.

WE'RE GOING TO SPEND CORRECTLY AND WISELY AND THEN IT COMES TO WHAT'S CORRECT AND WHAT'S WISE.

RIGHT.

>>LORENE: WELL IT DOES.

>>GEORGE: AND THAT'S WHERE DOCTOR NO COMES BACK-TO-BACK TO LIFE AGAIN.

YOU FIGURE OUT WE CAN DO THIS OR WE CAN'T DO IT AT ALL.

IS IT WELL THOUGHT OUT, DOES IT HAVE A PLAN, DOES IT HAVE A TRAJECTORY.

HOW'S IT GOING TO CHANGE NEW MEXICO?

AND THAT'S HOW YOU REALLY LOOK AT THINGS NOWADAYS.

>>LORENE: WELL, WE'RE SPEAKING TODAY WITH GEORGE MUNOZ, THE HEAD, THE CHAIR OF THE SENATE FINANCE COMMITTEE AND THE INTERIM LEGISLATIVE FINANCE COMMITTEE.

IT IS A MATTER OF EDUCATION OF GETTING OUR PEOPLE TO REALIZE THAT IT'S NOT A MATTER OF NOW OF SAYING TELL PEOPLE TO GO TO HELL POLITELY, BUT TO JUST SAY, LET'S LOOK AT THE BIG PICTURE AND LET'S LOOK AT WHAT WORKS FOR NEW MEXICO.

THANK YOU FOR MAKING THAT SHIFT.

>>GEORGE: YEAH, THAT'S A BIG SHIFT IN NEW MEXICO.

WE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY YOU BETTER USE AN OPPORTUNITY AS A BUSINESSMAN.

WHEN YOU HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY, YOU BETTER USE IT AND YOU BETTER USE IT TO YOUR BEST OF YOUR ABILITY, WHETHER IT'S YOUR PRIVATE BUSINESS OR AS I SIT HERE AS A STATE SENATOR.

>>LORENE: SO, HOW DO WE GET OUR PEOPLE TO EITHER MOVE FROM POVERTY CONSCIOUS, YOU KNOW, NEW MEXICANS USED TO BE REGARDED AS A POOR STATE, BUT NOW THAT IS ABSOLUTELY NOT TRUE.

HOW DO WE GET THE PEOPLE TO EMBRACE THAT AND CELEBRATE THAT AND THANK THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE USED THEIR VISION AND WISDOM TO MOVE US FROM, YOU KNOW, THE OLD WAY.

>>GEORGE: AN OLD WISE MAYOR WHEN ERNIE MILLS WAS IN GALLUP.

>>LORENE: YES, HE WAS WITH THE PAPER, REMEMBER, HE WAS WITH THE GALLUP INDEPENDENT .

>>GEORGE: I'LL TELL YOU SOMETHING HE TOLD ME.

>>LORENE: OH, TELL ME.

>>GEORGE: THERE'S ONE THING THAT I CAN GIVE YOU THAT NOBODY CAN EVER TAKE AWAY, NO MATTER WHAT YOU DO IN YOUR LIFE, THAT'S AN EDUCATION.

YOU CAN GO TO JAIL, THEY CAN'T TAKE THAT AWAY, YOU CAN GO WHEREVER, NOBODY CAN EVER TAKE YOUR EDUCATION AWAY, RIGHT?

SO LET'S EDUCATE OUR KIDS, WE STARTED THAT.

SENATOR SMITH DID NOT WANT TO TOUCH A PERMANENT FUND, BUT IT'S A CHANGING EDUCATIONAL SYSTEM AND YOU HAVE TO NOW CREATE IT FROM BIRTH.

WE'RE ALMOST THROUGH COLLEGE, RIGHT, WE'RE GIVING YOU OPPORTUNITIES THAT NOBODY'S EVER HAD BEFORE, USE THEM.

TO THE PARENTS THAT SAY I WANT MY KID TO BE EDUCATED.

THE MOST IMPORTANT THING THAT I CAN DO IN MY LIFE AS A FATHER.

>>LORENE: ABSOLUTELY.

THAT'S WITH ALL THE ABUELITAS, THE GRANDMOTHERS SAY, FIRST GET YOUR EDUCATION.

>>GEORGE: AND SO WE'VE DONE THAT.

WE HAVE THE GREATEST EARLY CHILDHOOD WITH THE LARGEST FUND IN THE UNITED STATES.

THAT'S WHERE WE START FROM CRADLE TO GET THEM INTO SCHOOL, THOSE BRAINS ABSORB LIKE SPONGES.

WE LEAD THOSE CHILDREN TO THE NEXT LEVEL, K THROUGH 12, OUR TEACHER SYSTEM AND HOW WE EDUCATE THE KIDS.

WE'RE LACKING A LITTLE BIT BETWEEN 6 AND 9.

>>LORENE: MIDDLE SCHOOL?

>>GEORGE: MIDDLE SCHOOL, THAT'S THE MOST DISCONNECT WHEN PUBERTY HITS CHILDREN AND THEY NEED TO CONNECT WITH SOMETHING.

THAT'S OUR GREATEST DROPOUT RATE.

>>LORENE: OH NO.

>>GEORGE: BUT THE BUT THE NUMBER ONE THING TO TARGET IN, I DON'T KNOW IF WE'VE DONE THIS CORRECTLY, YOU CAN ONLY WORK ON SO MANY THINGS.

1800 KIDS, IF THEY GRADUATED, WOULD PUT NEW MEXICO IN THE MEDIAN IN THE US, 1800 KIDS.

100 FROM ALBUQUERQUE, 200 FROM LAS CRUCES, 300 FROM SANTA FE, 50 FROM GALLUP, 50 FROM GRANTS, GETS US IN THE MIDDLE OF THE PACK.

>>LORENE: DO WE HAVE AN AGENCY, A DEPARTMENT WHOSE EYES ARE ON THAT VULNERABLE GROUP, WHO CAN SUPPORT THEM?

>>GEORGE: WE THINK WE DO, BUT I MEAN, THIS GOES BACK TO, WE JUST HEARD IT IN COMMITTEE.

WE NEED LEADERSHIP AND STABILITY FROM SUPERINTENDENTS.

WE'VE HAD 6 OR 7 CABINET SECRETARIES, WE HAD THIS ARGUMENT.

>>LORENE: THAT'S TRUE.

>>GEORGE: AND SO STABILITY IS KEY, RIGHT?

I MEAN IT'S KEY IN MY POSITION, SENATOR SMITH WAS THERE FOR WHAT 12 YEARS?

LISTEN, IF I MAKE IT THROUGH THE NEXT FOUR I'LL BE THERE THROUGH EIGHT.

STABILITY IS KEY IN WHAT YOU WANT TO ENVISION, BUT GETTING THAT 1800 STUDENTS, WHICH IS NOT A BIG NUMBER TO GET US IN THE MIDDLE OF THE US.

IS THAT NOT A CHANGE.

>>LORENE: YES, YES, YES.

>>GEORGE: I MEAN, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE NUMBERS GO DOWN TO IF WE GET 800, DOES THAT MOVE US TO NUMBER 42ND OR SOMETHING.

YEAH, THOSE ARE HARD NUMBERS TO DETERMINE.

>>LORENE: WELL, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I WANTED TO ASK YOU, IN THE GOVERNOR'S STATE OF THE STATE, SHE HAD SOME, SHE WANTS FREE CHILDCARE, SHE HAS ALL THESE BEAUTIFUL, IDEALISTIC, VISIONARY PLANS.

DO WE HAVE THE MONEY TO DO THAT, WHAT IS THE MISSING LINK?

IS IT VISIONARY LEADERSHIP, WE HAVE ENOUGH MONEY.

SO HOW DO WE PUT THAT IN PLACE AS A FOUNDATIONAL BLOCK FOR PROGRESS?

>>GEORGE: YOU CAN BE A JACK OF ALL TRADES, BUT NOT GOOD AT ANY.

AND SO A FOUR YEAR OLD AGENCY WITH $700 MILLION IN IT, HOW DO WE, THEY SAY THIS ALL THE TIME IN MCKINLEY COUNTY AND SAN JUAN COUNTY.

THERE'S, A VOID OF EARLY CHILDHOOD EDUCATION, ONE OF THE GREATEST MINORITY NEEDS IN THE STATE, SO HOW DO YOU SERVICE ALL THOSE FIRST AND THEN SAY, OKAY, WE GOT THIS PROGRAM DOWN, NOW LET'S EXPAND TO THE NEW ONE.

THERE'S A LIMIT TO WHAT WE CAN DO IN NEW MEXICO FOR THE CHILD WHO'S FROM CRADLE TO SIXTH GRADE AND PRE-K. THEN WE MOVE INTO K, LET'S PERFECT THAT BEFORE WE START THE NEXT STEP.

WE'VE ADDED FREE COLLEGE, WE'VE TAKEN THAT OPPORTUNITY, SO KIDS AND FAMILIES AREN'T SAYING I GOT TO SAVE FOR MY KID'S EDUCATION TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY HAVE THAT OPPORTUNITY.

WE'VE GIVEN THEM THAT K THROUGH 12 IS FREE, SO WE'RE PRETTY CLOSE.

SO WHAT'S THE LIMITS, BUT HOW DO WE REALLY PERFECT IT.

>>LORENE: THERE ARE SOME ISSUES, FOR EXAMPLE NATIVE AMERICANS.

ARE THERE SPECIAL PROGRAMS TO TRY TO CLOSE THAT GAP IN THE NATIVE AMERICAN COMMUNITY?

>>GEORGE: WELL, IN THE SCHOOL DISTRICTS THAT I REPRESENT IN MCKINLEY AND SAN JUAN, THEY'RE DOING THAT.

THE WORST THING I DO IS, IS HATE LABELING KIDS, ESPECIALLY NATIVE AMERICAN.

SO THEY'RE SMART, INTELLIGENT PEOPLE, THEY'RE JUST MIGHT BE SMARTER THAN ME.

SO DON'T PUT THAT LABEL ON THEM AND SAY DO WE REALLY NEED THAT?

WELL, SOMETIMES THEY NEED HELP BECAUSE OF FAMILIES, EVERY FAMILY IS THAT WAY.

HOW DO WE REALLY SAY YOU AS PARENTS, GIVE THEM AN EDUCATION, GET THEM TO SCHOOL, MAKE SURE THEY'RE THERE.

WE'LL HELP GET THEM FED, WE HAVE FREE LUNCHES, WE HAVE FREE MEALS, WE HAVE BACKPACKS TO GO HOME ON FRIDAYS.

WE HAVE WE HAVE ALL THE OPPORTUNITIES THERE.

IT'S HUMBLING TO TAKE, YOU KNOW, FOOD STAMPS OR FREE FOOD AND IN SCHOOLS THE UNIQUE THING IS, YOU KNOW, THAT KID DOESN'T HAVE TO DO ANYTHING, JUST EAT PEANUT BUTTER AND JELLY AND I GOTTA EAT THE SCHOOL LUNCHES, WHICH THE GOVERNOR SAYS ARE HORRIBLE.

WE WENT TO SANTA FE, WHICH WAS PRETTY GOOD ONE DAY.

>>LORENE: BUT WHAT I LIKE IS THAT THEY MADE IT FREE BREAKFAST AND LUNCH FOR EVERYBODY, SO THERE WAS NO BROWN BAG SECTION OVER HERE, THERE WAS NO DISCRIMINATION, EVERYBODY GOT TO EAT TOGETHER.

YOU KNOW, KIDS CAN'T LEARN IF THEY'RE HUNGRY, THEY JUST CAN'T.

AND SO THAT'S LIKE I CAN'T BELIEVE THAT ANYONE WOULD HAVE ARGUED AGAINST THAT.

>>GEORGE: YEAH I MEAN WE'VE CREATED THE STRUCTURES.

LET'S GET THEM ALL FUNDED CORRECTLY AND LET'S SUCCEED BEFORE WE REALLY MOVE ON TO THIS NEXT THING.

THEN YOU'RE AT THE END OF AN EXECUTIVE'S TERM, SO HOW MUCH CAN THEY REALLY ACCOMPLISH AT THE END OF THE TERM OF TWO YEARS.

SO YOU'RE CAUTIONARY ABOUT WHAT WE REALLY NEED TO DO AND CAN ACCOMPLISH BECAUSE WE DON'T KNOW WHO THE NEXT GOVERNOR IS GOING TO BE AND WHOEVER IT IS YOU DON'T WANT TO START A PROGRAM AND THEN CHOP IT OFF.

>>LORENE: RIGHT, BUT I THINK PHILOSOPHICALLY, THE VALUE OF EDUCATION IS, LIKE I SAY, FOUNDATIONAL.

WE JUST HAVE TO WORK ON THAT.

SO YOUR PHILOSOPHY, HOW DO YOU COMMUNICATE YOUR IDEAS TO THE VOTERS OUT THERE SAYING, WHY WE NEED TO DO THIS?

THERE'S A STRATA OF, YOU KNOW, THE OLDER PEOPLE WHO TELL THE YOUNG PEOPLE THAT IF YOU ACTUALLY GET A HIGHER, GET FURTHER EDUCATION, IT WILL PAY OFF IN YOUR LONG-TERM ANNUAL EMPLOYMENT AND SALARY.

INVEST JUST A LITTLE TIME NOW AND GET TO REALLY WORK ON YOUR EDUCATION AND IT WILL PAY OFF.

BUT THEY WOULD PERHAPS LIKE TO HAVE A NEW CAR, IT'S HARD TO GET THEIR ATTENTION SOMETIMES.

HOW CAN WE FIX THAT?

>>GEORGE: WELL, YOU KNOW, I THINK IT COMES DOWN TO A LOT OF PARENT INVOLVEMENT.

AT THE END OF THE DAY, WE WANT KIDS IN SCHOOL AND WE WANT PARENTS TO HELP THOSE KIDS COME HOME AND READ AT NIGHT, HELP THEM DO MATH, HELP THEM GET THAT AND IT COMES DOWN LIKE, SOMETIMES THERE'S A POVERTY DEAL AND I CAN TELL YOU, THE WAY YOU AND I DID MATH IS NOT THE WAY THEY DO MATH TODAY.

>>LORENE: I KNOW, I'D BE LOST.

>>GEORGE: MY KID HOME CAME HOME ONE TIME AND THEN LIKE, SO HOW DO WE HELP THE PARENTS NAVIGATE THAT NEW SYSTEM?

BECAUSE IT'S COMPLETELY DIFFERENT.

WHEN COVID HAPPENED, KIDS ARE COMPLETELY DIFFERENT THAN THEY WERE BEFORE.

>>LORENE: ABSOLUTELY.

>>GEORGE: THEY LEARN COMPLETELY DIFFERENTLY AND SO WE'RE MAKING THOSE ADJUSTMENTS.

BUT HOW DO WE REALLY GET THE PARENTS INVOLVED, BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT REALLY MATTERS.

>>LORENE: RIGHT, BECAUSE THE PARENTS, EVEN IF IT'S A ZOOM CLASS, THE PARENTS CAN'T EVEN, SOME CAN'T EVEN NAVIGATE SETTING THEM UP SO THE KID CAN ATTEND VIA ZOOM.

>>GEORGE: I BELIEVE THEY CAN NAVIGATE BECAUSE THEY ALL GOT FACEBOOK, INSTAGRAM, SOCIAL MEDIA.

>>LORENE: IT'S TRUE.

SO YOU THINK WE HAVE ENOUGH MONEY THAT WE CAN DO THIS IF WE APPLY IT WELL AND HAVE A STRUCTURE OF GOALS AND GUIDELINES.

>>GEORGE: AND REPORTING.

THE WORLD IS FULL OF ENDLESS POSSIBILITIES AND HOW DO WE CAPTURE THOSE FOR OUR PEOPLE, FOR NEW MEXICO.

>>LORENE: SO HOW DO WE, GIVE US SOME ADVICE, WHAT DO OUR, YOU KNOW, THE PBS AUDIENCE.

>>GEORGE: NOW YOU'RE GOING TO MAKE ME TELL YOU NO.

I AM NOT THE ULTIMATE WISDOM, RIGHT?

>>LORENE: NO, NO, NO, BUT WE HAVE SOME GOOD SUGGESTIONS, YOUR FINGER IS ON THE PULSE.

>>GEORGE: WE HAVE 42 GREAT SENATORS.

>>LORENE: YES WE DO.

>>GEORGE: AND WE HAVE THAT CONVERSATION, HOW DO WE LEAD NEW MEXICO INTO A DIFFERENT PATH?

IT'S BIPARTISAN, IT CAN GET DIFFERENT SEPARATED AT DIFFERENT TIMES, AND YOU KNOW THE DEMOCRATS OUTNUMBER THE REPUBLICANS, BUT THERE'S GREAT INPUT.

SO YOU HAVE TO LISTEN TO THE PEOPLE AROUND YOU BECAUSE I'M NOT AN EXPERT ON ANYTHING.

MAYBE PLUMBING AND SEWER LINES, BUT I MEAN, THAT'S WHY WE NEED EXPERTS AND THAT'S WHY WE HAVE A LEGISLATURE TO HAVE DIFFERENT POINTS OF VIEW AND HOW PROCESSES ARE DIFFERENT AND WHAT IS THE BEST DIRECTION FOR NEW MEXICO.

>>LORENE: FROM MY POINT OF VIEW AS AN OBSERVER, I'VE BEEN PLEASED AT HOW BIPARTISAN THE EFFORTS FOR EDUCATION HAVE BEEN.

YOU KNOW, I THINK LOS ALAMOS IS THE ONLY ONE THAT HAS A DIFFERENT FUNDING FORMULA BECAUSE THEY HAD TO GET THE SCIENTISTS TO COME THERE AND PUT THEIR KIDS IN SCHOOL THERE, BUT OTHERWISE IT'S PRETTY MUCH EVENLY DISTRIBUTED.

>>GEORGE: WELL, LOS ALAMOS WAS GIVEN IMPACT AID AND NOT TAKEN AWAY WHEN GALLUP, MCKINLEY COUNTY, NATIVE AMERICAN KIDS WERE GIVEN THE SAME THING.

WE FIXED THAT 3 OR 4 YEARS AGO, MAYBE FIVE, SO NOW THEY'RE ON THE EQUAL PLAYING FIELD, WHERE THE FEDERAL MONEY THAT'S SUPPOSED TO GO TO THE DISTRICT FOR KIDS THAT ARE IMPACTED BY RESERVATIONS AND NON-TAX PAYING BASES, BALANCE THAT OUT.

AND SO THAT'S WHY LOS ALAMOS ALWAYS HAD A BIGGER CHUNK THAN EVERYBODY ELSE, BUT THE STATE ALWAYS TOOK CREDIT FOR NATIVE AMERICAN KIDS AND WE FIXED THAT.

>>LORENE: YEAH, GOOD.

>>GEORGE: SO THE DIRECTORY IS CHANGING, MONEY'S NOT THE ISSUE, IT'S THE QUALITY.

>>LORENE: YEAH, YEAH.

AND THEN, ALSO EYES ON THE RESULT, YOU KNOW, HOW ARE THESE KIDS TESTING, HOW ARE THESE KIDS TESTING.

AND IF WE SEE DISPARITY, CAN WE GIVE THEM WHAT THEY NEED TO RISE TO THE SAME LEVEL.

>>GEORGE: AND WE'VE DONE THAT AND DONE THAT THROUGH THE FAMILY INCOME INDEX, WE'VE DONE IT THROUGH EVERYTHING WE COULD THINK OF TO MAKE KIDS SUCCESSFUL IN THE SCHOOLS.

>>LORENE: GOOD, GOOD.

WELL, WE JUST HAVE TWO MINUTES LEFT.

I WOULD LOVE IT IF YOU COULD TELL US WHAT PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW AND WHAT THE AUDIENCE CAN DO TO, YOU KNOW, IT TAKES A VILLAGE TO PARTICIPATE IN BEING SURE THAT EVERY CHILD GETS A REALLY GOOD EDUCATION.

>>GEORGE: WE KNOW THAT UNDER THE PRIOR ADMINISTRATION, UNDER GOVERNOR MARTINEZ, BEHAVIORAL HEALTH WAS DESTROYED.

>>LORENE: THAT WAS TERRIBLE.

>>GEORGE: AND WE'VE NEVER REBUILT IT.

SO THIS YEAR WE'VE COMMITTED IN THE LEGISLATURE BIPARTISAN HOUSE, SENATE, REPUBLICANS, DEMOCRATS, EVERYBODY IS COMMITTED TO BEHAVIORAL HEALTH.

HOW DO WE MAKE THAT SYSTEM BUILD BACK UP IN NEW MEXICO?

THAT'S AN IMPORTANT THING BECAUSE EVERYBODY HAS A MENTAL HEALTH ISSUE IN THEIR FAMILY, WHETHER THEY ADMIT IT OR NOT.

IT HITS HOME SO MANY PLACES THAT IT'S UNIMAGINABLE.

WE'RE GOING TO REBUILD THAT.

>>LORENE: THAT'S WONDERFUL, BECAUSE PEOPLE WHO HAD A STRUCTURE AND WHO HAD SUPPORT IT JUST CUT THEM LOOSE, THEY WOULD BE IN FREE FALL.

>>GEORGE: I MEAN, THAT'S WHAT WE'VE GOT TO REBUILD.

I MEAN CRIMES AN ISSUE, BUT THERE'S UNDERLYING BEHAVIORAL HEALTH ISSUES SOMETIMES.

SOMETIMES IT'S NOT, SOMETIMES IT'S JUST THUGS BEING IN GANGS, BUT WE'RE GOING TO DEAL WITH THAT HEADFIRST IN THE LEGISLATURE.

THEN WE'RE GOING TO COME BACK AND DEAL WITH A LOT OF CRIME ISSUES, HOW DO WE MAKE SURE PEOPLE ARE GETTING IN THE RIGHT PLACE.

WE WENT TO A SPECIAL SESSION, EXEC DIDN'T HAVE ANY BILLS, THEY WANTED US TO DO THAT.

WE'RE NOT GOING TO DO THAT.

YOU CALL THE SPECIAL, YOU COME WITH A PLAN, AND WE'LL SEE IF WE LIKE IT OR DON'T LIKE IT.

BUT WE'RE GOING TO WORK TOGETHER THIS SESSION WITH THE GOVERNOR.

WE'RE GOING TO WORK ON BEHAVIORAL HEALTH ISSUES, WE'RE GOING TO MAKE SURE THAT ISSUE IN NEW MEXICO IS TAKEN ON HAMMER AND NAIL AND HEADFIRST, AND REALLY COME TO SOME RESOLVE IN WHAT DIRECTION.

>>LORENE: I AM SO HAPPY TO HEAR THAT.

OUR GUEST TODAY IS GEORGE MUNOZ WHO IS CHAIR OF THE SENATE FINANCE COMMITTEE AND IN THE INTERIM, THE CHAIR OF THE LEGISLATIVE FINANCE COMMITTEE.

I AM GRATEFUL TO YOU FOR LETTING US KNOW WHAT'S BEING DONE AND I'M NOW FEELING MUCH BETTER ABOUT EDUCATION.

THANK YOU VERY MUCH.

>>GEORGE: THANK YOU, THANK YOU FOR HAVING ME.

>>LORENE: YOU BET AND I'M LORENE MILLS.

I'D LIKE TO THANK YOU, OUR AUDIENCE, FOR BEING WITH US TODAY ON REPORT FROM SANTA FE .

WE'LL SEE YOU NEXT WEEK.

REPORT FROM SANTA FE IS MADE POSSIBLE, IN PART, BY GRANTS FROM THE NEW MEXICO MUNICIPAL LEAGUE, A BETTER NEW MEXICO THROUGH BETTER CITIES AND FROM THE HEALY FOUNDATION, TAOS, NM.

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